Vw tdi ??

cav has been

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Full Member
Minuteman
Apr 25, 2008
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wilds of montana
Distinguished brotherhood of the Hide, I would like some input pro or con on the V-dub diesels. I've got some changes in my life and it looks like I'm going to have to put around 40K miles a year on my vehicle. I'm accustomed to putting on quite a few miles on my 1 ton Dodge Brothers diesel but this is a bit different. Mostly need to just haul my ass about 200 mi. every other day.
At this point the advertised 40+ mpg on the Jettas and Passant is looking pretty good but I have Zero experience with small diesel automobiles. Constructive comments if you please?
 
Everyone's experience will differ but I have owned a TDI Jetta for the last 5 years or so. Mine now has about 170,000 miles on it, it gets driven a lot, and the only work has been regular service, timing belt and a clutch. The radio in it was shit but that was easy to replace. I doubt I will ever buy a gas car again, even the 35+ mpg ones. I have been in hybrids and high mileage small cars and every time I am glad I have mine. When you need to accelerate it actually does. It makes a Prius seem like a pedal car. I get at least 40 MPG, and that is when loaded with two 45lbs downhill bikes and riding/camping gear for 3-4 days. I would recommend getting the auto transmission. I have friends with them and the way the transmission is set up it actually gets better mileage than the manual, and you can still shift gears if you want. Take my experience for what it's worth, opinions will vary but I love mine and none of the problems others say they have. The one down side to them is that parts are not cheap. Filters, lights, etc, everything seems to be made of gold from what they charge ;) I would recommend finding a good diesel mechanic that knows VW's since it seems most of their guys don't really know crap about them.
 
The diesel VW's are nice. Certain VW's can be problematic, especially w/ electronics. In the past the Mexican manufactured one's were more prone to issues. Overall, great suspension and safe vehicles. I would buy a TDI in a heartbeat.
 
Owned a 2001 Jetta TDI put 225,000 miles on it no major problems to speak of.
Sold it for $4600 in less than 24 hours.

Purchased a new passat tdi last May (made in TN) just turned 25k no issues as of yet.
Fuel mileage is right around 40-42 all highway at 70-80 MPH
 
We bought a used one this past november. The dumbass mechanic at the car lot replaced the dual-mass flywheel and timing belt while in their proper. He did not, however reassemble the car correctly, causing an engine mount bolt to snap, and the dsg to take a crap. 4200 dollars later, we have a bang up car. gets close to 50, really.
 
2012 German made VW Golf TDI with the DSG. Average 44.5mpg with it last summer, over the winter I'm down to 38.5.
Its got 30,000 miles on it now and I really like the car. Comfortable, great sound system, excellent mileage and enough torque to get you moving good.

When I was looking, many people told me to stay away from the Jetta because they are made in Mexico and aren't nearly as well made.
 
2012 VW Jetta TDI with 42K miles in 16 months. I drive it hard and always get +40. I enjoy the fact that on gravel roads, at 45 mph and in 4th gear, I can floor it and spin the front tires. Hehe. I have had no troubles so far and would make the purchase again. I do miss my Tundra 4WD but I get paid mileage and the money saved is paying for the car and helping finance a 74 Bronco restoration.

The Jetta isn't too scared of the mud either, just need a little extra speed.......
 
1998 Jetta TDI that gets 49 - 51 on the freeway at 65 -70 MPH. Normally 46 - 47 MPG driving locally, but mileage can drop to 43 MPG in really cold weather or snow covered roads. It had gremlin first 50k, but the last 130k just maintenance.
 
The key to the TDI is being accurate on changing your timing belt. It really is one of those every 100k mi things. If you do that the motor will never stop. It's just broken in at 150k. Add bigger fuel injectors and a new chip and it produces 150hp and around 300ftlbs while still getting great mileage. Super sleeper. Plus it drives and feels like a ncie German car.
 
My better half drives a 2011 Jetta Diesel TdI. Has 24K miles on it already (long daily Interstate commute) and it's been just perfect. She gets 49-51 MPG on her commute every day and an average including around town in the 40's. It's peppy, comfy and gets something like 600 miles on a tank of gas. The wagon has a ton of space in it. We have a steep, icy driveway in winter... and a muddy one in spring/fall. It goes up no problem, though we have studded winter tires on it. I've been a huge fan of little diesels for years and this car puts your silly hybrid junk to shame. Outstanding (not so) small car and if you have to drive long distance, you can't beat the Tdi.

We joke that her car is free... because she had been driving a V6 Escape for years. The gas savings on the TdI is so great that she is saving her car payment in reduced gas expenditures every month. So for her it's like having a free car!

Cheers,

Sirhr
 
Now i'm not sure if I am debating my statement about being in 4th gear and spinning the tires in gravel at 45 mph. I may do it in 3rd. Anyway.....Anything spinning the tires at 45 MPH makes me grin... The trunk seems to be decent sized too. The back seat of my Bronco fits in there with room for groceries.
 
Drove around in a '05 jetta tdi and got 50+ miles to the gallon. Absolutely loved it until I got into a car accident and almost killed myself. The car did surprisingly protect me all things considered, but shattering vertebrae doesnt leave the best memories even though it wasn't the cars fault.
 
We side swiped a guard rail going 70mph around a curve on our way home from a trip(06 jetta). I figured the fender would be smashed and parts hanging off the car, but there was just a little rub mark/dent half way up and the rims needed buffed out. I was impressed with how it handled the hit. Do some math on paying more for diesel and oil changes that brings the value down on the mileage.
 
Those little diesel cars ain't bad for longer trips, and in some sort of almost perverse fashion, they're kinda fun to drive (not just from the standpoint of the powertrain dynamics, but also in the challenge of maximizing MPG). That being said, consider the following:

1) Initial purchase price, maintenance, and repair on a diesel will be more expensive than on a gas motor.

2) Diesel fuel prices are pretty crazy at times - within the past 2-3 months, I've seen diesel come within $0.10 of gas prices (at which point diesel has a pretty clear advantage in fuel costs), and I've seen it $0.80 more expensive.

The fuel economy and performance of diesel and gas engines has gotten much closer over the past several years (diesel got worse due to emissions controls, gasoline got better with great use of turbocharging, direct injection, and VVT). When you consider the above factors, you may find that it takes several years to get a positive return-on-investment with a diesel motor... if indeed it ever happens.

That being said, owning a car is more than an investment exercise, and there is little wrong with simply making yourself happy. Just be honest with yourself if trying to justify this purely based upon the math.

Anything spinning the tires at 45 MPH makes me grin...

Yeah, my '08 Ford F-250 will do the same thing... on dry pavement :) Once the boost gauge sweeps past 40 PSI, things get a bit crazy.
 
2012 German made VW Golf TDI with the DSG. Average 44.5mpg with it last summer, over the winter I'm down to 38.5.
Its got 30,000 miles on it now and I really like the car. Comfortable, great sound system, excellent mileage and enough torque to get you moving good.

When I was looking, many people told me to stay away from the Jetta because they are made in Mexico and aren't nearly as well made.

Same here. I love it.
 
Thank you gentlemen! I appreciate the reasoned responses. I will ponder this a bit longer and try to learn more about these cars. I've already learned two things about them; 1 the back seat folds down leaving plenty of room for long guns. 2 late model used VW tdi's are scarce and spendy.
( Switch, that ain't a gonna happen. I've got a garage more than half full of hot rods now, not gonna buy a ricer toy )
 
I've got a 2012 Jetta TDI auto w/ 28k on it. When I was back in MN driving 80+ miles everyday, the worst I got was 38, best 43. This was mostly all highway/country driving. Now that I'm in NC, it's very mixed, probably heavier on the city. That said, I'm still getting mid 30's on average. I took a trip to Knoxville, TN a few weeks back and got 40.5mpg going thru the Smoky mtns. No real problems to date as far as reliability.

As others have said, there are going to be a few more options in the coming year. The Chevy Cruze will be out in August most likely. I also believe Mazda is bringing over their Skyactiv-D sometime in the next year or so.
 
Seems like several manufacturers are introducing small diesels to the US market in 2013, including Chrysler. Jeep's been selling a diesel Liberty for a few years now. Don't think I'd buy a new-to-US model the first year or two. I think there will be problems getting EU diesels to work well with US EPA crap, based on what I've seen.
One thing about diesels: Drive 'em hard. IMHO, they don't respond well to being babied.


1911fan
 
All I know is VW fall apart. Play at your own risk.

While nothing is perfect my 2003 Jetta TDI has 266k on it, still gets 53-54mpg, at 99k I changed the MAF, I packed the connector with dielectric grease and don't expect to change it again, at 225k the AC compressor clutch came apart, I change the oil oil filter, fuel filter and air cleaner every 20k, I run Miclean tires at 40psi and change them every 80k, and I don't rotate, brakes lasted 170k, and I'm still on the original clutch.

Had a 2005 Beetle TDI, dam thing was Yellow, my wife's car, we put 100k on it and sold it for $13k, not bad return on the dollar with only a $9k loss over 100kmiles

My wife now drives a 2011 Jetta TDI 6 spd manual, my plan is to take this car and buy her a new one so I screwed her with a manual trans, the DSG gets slightly better MPG but requires service every 40k, the tools to it cost 700 bucks, and the parts 120, or 400 ish at the dealer, so far this car is a total blast to drive, and of corse we have had zero problems with 40k on it, the engine still has 20k to go before its fully broke in, it averages 46mpg.

If you buy a VW/Audi product anywhere on the planet except North America the car will come with a STEEL skid plate, all NA cars come with a PLASTIC dust cover, I highly recommend a Panzer skid plate from www.dieselgeek.com. If you don't have a skid plate DO NOT EVER pass over road dibre, the engine and trans are 4 inches from the ground.

The VW owners manual says change the oil every 10k, do it any sooner or more frequently and your costing yourself money, my 03 the oil is available at Walmart, I have done oil analysis and 20k changes are GTG. The 05 Beetle had a different engine and required special oil only available at the dealer, oil analysis also said 20k intervals were fine, I just did my first oil change on the 11, dealer did the others for free, at 50k I will send the oil off for analysis.

From 04 and on all TDIs require special oil to protect the cam, cam bearings, don't think that a issue, oil at the dealers is competitively priced, and is good oil, all TDIs use synthetic oil. I buy my filter packs from www.idparts.com, there is no reason what so ever to get under the car to change the oil, the filter is on top, I suck the oil out of the dipstick with a Pela oil extractor, with the oil hot I pull the dipstick and stick the suction tube in, pump the Pela 4-5 times and come back in 10 minutes to finish the job, simply and easy, don't think for one second that draining is better, the dipstick goes right to the bottom of the oil pan, I have over 400000 miles of TDI use that backs this up as sound practice.
 
From 04 and on all TDIs require special oil to protect the cam, cam bearings, don't think that a issue, oil at the dealers is competitively priced, and is good oil, all TDIs use synthetic oil.

Rotella T6, as well as Mobil TDT has been found to exceed the appropriate VW spec. If you're like me and the nearest VW dealership is 100 miles away, it's a readily available alternative.
 
Rotella T6, as well as Mobil TDT has been found to exceed the appropriate VW spec. If you're like me and the nearest VW dealership is 100 miles away, it's a readily available alternative.


Hmm, Rotella T6 5w-40 is what I use in my 03 since day one, the 11 uses 5w-30, and is specially made for the DPF, I used M1 ESP, the DPF is a rather exspensive part, I would rather not chance f-ing it up.
 
... the DSG gets slightly better MPG but requires service every 40k ...

...I highly recommend a Panzer skid plate from www.dieselgeek.com....

The VW owners manual says change the oil every 10k, do it any sooner or more frequently and your costing yourself money, my 03 the oil is available at Walmart, I have done oil analysis and 20k changes are GTG. The 05 Beetle had a different engine and required special oil only available at the dealer, oil analysis also said 20k intervals were fine, I just did my first oil change on the 11, dealer did the others for free, at 50k I will send the oil off for analysis.


Correction... The manual gets better milage. It has a lower final drive ratio. In the 2009/10's they were the same, 2011 it was changed. Ends up to be a 3-5mpg increase. I had intentions on trading my 2012 DSG this year for a 2014 Std trans but will be waiting another year and buying a 2015 RAM 1500 diesel.

+1 on the Panzer Plate.

At the handful of oil analysis's I've seen so far, 12k changes seem to be about the max we can run before the TB# gets too low.
 
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Americans are talking about dizels and WV and it aint a hippie wagon nor heavy truck....

What has the world come to...

Seriously though good engines well worth the money. If you chip it you can squeeze even some more power out of it and run it either faster or normal with less consumption.
 
I have an 06 with the PD engine, the one with common camshaft issues. This is the engine I was referring to T6 and TDT being suitable for. I have no knowledge of the later common rail engines.
 
I wouldn’t assume that being manufactured in Germany means it’s a better built car. The wife drove an Audi A4 Quattro 3.0 (made in Germany) for two years and it stayed at the dealers about as much as our garage.

If you want something to put miles on, buy a used Camry or Accord.

This.

I own a 99 camry, it ugly, and slow. But it hasnt broken down in the 7 years Ive driven it. I do preventative maintenance, but I havnt had any parts break on it at all. Paid 10k cash for it when it had 22k miles on it, now it has 135k. It averages around 32 mpg, I know thats not what a diesel would get but you have to account for what fuel costs, after that the difference is nominal.
 
Running anything but a low ash, ESP oil will slowly clog up the DPF on newer CR engines. There are only a handful of options currently available stateside.

What is so special about the TDI that doesn't allow the use of a typical CJ-4 oil (which is designed and specified for '07-up diesel engines running DPF)? Oil meeting that spec is available at just about any parts store.
 
I have a '03 jetta tdi gets 48 mpg, I also have a dodge brothers 1 ton getting 15mpg i drive about 64 mi. round trip every day save over 200 a month driving the jetta. plus maint. is cheaper on the jetta than it is on the dodge. I had a toyota tercel gasoline engine getting 36 mpg for a while, even with an eighty cent price difference the jetta is still cheaper. its also much more comfortable and safer than the tercel was.
 
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It averages around 32 mpg, I know thats not what a diesel would get but you have to account for what fuel costs, after that the difference is nominal.[/QUOTE]


My 03 cost me 72 bucks every 20k to change the oil and filters(cabin air oil), I stop every 800 miles for fuel, the gas station close to my house sell regular for 3.699 and diesel for 3.889, straight up over the last 100k miles not including tires or timing belt cost me based on the those numbers cost me 7480.00 in fuel and 360.00 in maintenance, your Camry over the last 100k cost you 11560.00 just in gas, if I add in the timing belt, the tires, and the AC compressor that I didn't fell like fixing myself I still have over a thousand dollars less money spent than you, does that seem nominal to you.
 
The economic proposition of a diesel is going to be heavily dependent upon fuel costs. Anyone who is trying to justify this purchase based solely on the numbers is well-advised to run a variety of scenarios regarding fuel costs. Sure, the delta between diesel and gas is only around $0.20/gallon right now, but it wasn't but a couple of months ago where the difference was more like $0.75/gal.
 
Have a 2009 TDI Jetta Sportwagen 6 speed with 85K, no issues to speak of and mpg between 37 -40 at 75 - 80mph on interstate, local driving 42 - 50 depending on traffic flow.

No regrets and would purchase again,

Ed
 
The economic proposition of a diesel is going to be heavily dependent upon fuel costs. Anyone who is trying to justify this purchase based solely on the numbers is well-advised to run a variety of scenarios regarding fuel costs. Sure, the delta between diesel and gas is only around $0.20/gallon right now, but it wasn't but a couple of months ago where the difference was more like $0.75/gal.

Agreed...one needs to look at the price difference as well as the mileage difference to see if it makes sense.

For example, if one looks at the 2013 Passat, the diesel/automatic specs to 34mpg combined, whereas the automatic is 25mpg.

So you get 36% more MPG, for 10-15% higher per-gallon costs. So on that alone, diesel "wins" by a fairly significant margin. However, you've got to consider the delta in acquisition cost between a gas-powered model and a diesel model, along with differences in maintenance expenses.
 
My experience having owned a TDI's and observations of others with VW's, the engines will run pretty much forever with routine maintenance and the little things go on them. Windows start to stop going up and down, stereo buttons fall off and plastic pieces start to break around 100K miles.

The air intake manifold needs to be cleaned out pretty regularly (every 60 - 80K miles). It's not a cheap job, as they need to disassemble the engine and then sand blast the manifold. You'll know when it's time when you start trying to accelerate and it feels like it's bogging down and choking the engine.
 
Agreed...one needs to look at the price difference as well as the mileage difference to see if it makes sense.

For example, if one looks at the 2013 Passat, the diesel/automatic specs to 34mpg combined, whereas the automatic is 25mpg.

So you get 36% more MPG, for 10-15% higher per-gallon costs. So on that alone, diesel "wins" by a fairly significant margin. However, you've got to consider the delta in acquisition cost between a gas-powered model and a diesel model, along with differences in maintenance expenses.

Therefore it becomes a question of how much you drive. If you make a 75 mile one-way commute five days a week, you will see financial advantage much sooner than someone who lives 15 minutes from work.

Alternately, you can own one because they are fun as hell, and damn the logic. With a $200 tune they'll make 140hp/250tq which in a compact four door is a blast to drive, and you still get 45-50 mpg for the road trips. This is where I am. Yes, they are more expensive. But there's nothing funnier than outrunning a prick in his new yellow camaro rs in your 4-door mommy-car.
 
What is so special about the TDI that doesn't allow the use of a typical CJ-4 oil (which is designed and specified for '07-up diesel engines running DPF)? Oil meeting that spec is available at just about any parts store.

As a disclaimer, I do not claim to be an expert in this subject... but oil must meet VW 507.00 or MB 223.?? spec to be used in a CR TDI. VW has a very specific spec to which oil must conform to. Now, will the typical CJ-4 oil work in it without issue? Probably, but I won't be testing it out should something happen and they trace it back to an "non-spec" oil.

If you really want to know more, I suggest running over to forums.tdiclub.com and check out the "Fuels and Lubricants" discussion area.
 
There was a guy in Woodstock that was running a little 120v pump plus extra filter off his #2 fuel oil tank in the house, and getting real cheap diesel fuel. Don't know enough about the difference in fuels to say if this would screw up the engine. He had a Jetta.
 
There was a guy in Woodstock that was running a little 120v pump plus extra filter off his #2 fuel oil tank in the house, and getting real cheap diesel fuel. Don't know enough about the difference in fuels to say if this would screw up the engine. He had a Jetta.

I don't know about other states but thats illegal here in MN. Lord help you if you ever get caught doing that.
 
The air intake manifold needs to be cleaned out pretty regularly (every 60 - 80K miles). It's not a cheap job, as they need to disassemble the engine and then sand blast the manifold. You'll know when it's time when you start trying to accelerate and it feels like it's bogging down and choking the engine.

I don't believe the newer CR engines have the intake coking issue. Think that was mainly on the older AHL engines.
 
Here some people cheat with "heating oil" and using that (basically regular diesel with different coloring and half the price) but there are supposed to be problems with impurities and severe fines if caught (first time fine and second time bye bye car) but i guess risk/reward is nowhere near the ration most of the people would consider viable so its limited to older cars/tractors and not really widespread.
 
There was a guy in Woodstock that was running a little 120v pump plus extra filter off his #2 fuel oil tank in the house, and getting real cheap diesel fuel. Don't know enough about the difference in fuels to say if this would screw up the engine. He had a Jetta.

I don't know about other states but thats illegal here in MN. Lord help you if you ever get caught doing that.

I'm pretty sure this is illegal nationwide b/c there is no road tax on it. Some years back, my dad took a 90 something Dodge Powerwagon in on trade and it had be set up to pull off-road fuel from the tank in the box with the turn of a valve on the floor of the cab. It wasn't until we sold it that we found out it had been set up for it.
 
If you really want to know more, I suggest running over to forums.tdiclub.com and check out the "Fuels and Lubricants" discussion area.

Na, not really that concerned - all I know is that my '08 Ford came from the factory with a DPF and seems to behave just fine on the specified CJ-4 oil. If a manufacturer wants to go create their own magic blend instead of using an API grade for whatever reason, real or imaged - well, that's up to them. It just decreases the likelihood of me purchasing that particular vehicle.
 
I had a 04 Jetta 6speed TDI, drove it 80 miles a day at 75mph and got 48mpg. Sold it to a buddy when I bought a 2008 Grand Cherokee diesel, I put a 100thou on it and he just put another 100thou on it. All I ever did to it was scheduled maintenance, he out a fuel pump in it at 180thou and just recently a new clutch. I like my Jeep but I'm lookin into buyin a Golf TDI for up and back to work, at $4 a gallon 48mpg beats the hell out of the 22mpg my jeep gets.
 
I have a 2012 Jetta Wagon TDI that gets used for my business to the tune of about 500 miles per week. Gets 38-40 mpg consistently and can haul a lot of s**t for as small as it looks. Drove it out to Montana last fall for elk hunting from Minnesota and only stopped to "top" off the tank each direction. Fun to drive (auto 6 speed) and really comfortable. I was in Sweden last summer for business and you see more diesel wagons of all makes being driven than almost any other kind of car. There was more of these cars pulling large travel trailers than I ever thought possible. The Audi wagon rental I drove while there got almost 70 mpg. We could do the same here if the took some of the pollution BS off the cars.