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Why AI?
- Thread starter Hecouldgoalltheway
- Start date
I remember that! That guy shouldn’t be allowed to own anything but a savage for a period of not less that 7-10 years as a punishment
The British "Car" magazine used to have a very short review of all cars in the last two pages. This is what they had on Toyota Corolla:
- The good: Reliable
- The bad: Reliable
- Sum up: Proof that 50 million people can be wrong
And Sweden is in the list of users, too.Sako TRG M10 is one choice.
For sure not as sexy as AI, but everything on around on the action, it is.
Not even close to popularity in the US, but think it is as good as AI if you compare it these two.
In EU there are countries like Estonia, and Finland that has chosen Sako TRG M10 in to a new sniper rifle system, and Canada too.
And i dont think it is difficult to a propper gun smith to do a change barrel for this rifle.
Trigger is by far one the best 2-stage trigger i have pulled.
Take a look one of these too.
TRG M10…cool, nice rifle, I have one in .338LM. At a cost of $11k+ and further refinement, it turns into a $13k rig. You can buy 2 AI AX or 3 PRS rifles. When Beretta bought Sako, all prices went up.
Also Sako does not wish to sell barrel extensions, so a factory barrel needs to be sacrificed to make what you want…
Mr. #374 says you are a liar.
The top ten scores for every serious nrl/prs match in the country this year state that AI isn't a prs rifle. That is undeniable cold hard data. Winners in those disciplines don't shoot AI. Maybe they haven't had the life changing moment of experiencing the joy of running the AT action(think bright light, angels, harps playing) to let them know they been messing up running an impact or fuzion all this time! I mean Matt Alwine wins with a fn factory savage......not an ai. Those guys will win with anything, cuz they're at that level, none choose AI. Get off the high horse AI God complex, it's a fn brick house rough and crude but reliable action that performs, it has crap table manners, isn't glamorous, but if does work and has for a long time. The rifle systems as a whole do a lot well, but is it any better equal value custom components put together by a good smith? No it comes up short other than a quick change barrel setup.
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Did any of us say it's the end all be all of gamer guns? Nope. I really think you missed the point of the whole thread. The AI was never originally designed to compete in PRS/NRL. Nothing wrong with that. It has been repeated in this thread at least 5-6 times already. Get over yourself. Yeah we get it, you like to shoot PRS/NRL. The AI didn't fit your needs. Guess what, not everyone here cares about that retarded ass "sport". This is almost as bad as me saying that you never see top shooter in F-Class or Benchrest shooting a AI. It's garbage. We all buy different things for different reasons.
I agree with most of this, except the part I put in bold. They can be a jack of all trades, but they are without doubt masters of the one thing they were designed to do - be a top-tier military combat sniper weapon system. There may be equals in this role, but none better.
You have to decide for yourself if this type of system can be adapted to your intended personal use, or if something else might fit your needs better. There are so many possibilities that obviously no single weapon is going to be the best choice for all, especially AIs, because there was only one design criteria for them. That said, people have obviously done well with them in lots of pursuits, even if not tip-top finishers. One obvious example is the Nightforce ELR Challenge, where they have won several. I guess the simplest answer to the OP is that the closer your style of shooting resembles that of its design-intent (precision long range/ELR shooting in any condition you can imagine), the more it will rise to the top as the best choice. The farther away you get from that, then the opposite is true.
(disclaimer: My experience and comments are based off AXMCs and AXSRs, plus the reputations and history of the legacy rifles. I don't have any experience with the AT-X, and am not including them here.)
You could say that about pretty much any high end shooting related product. Optics comes to mind.
Why?
1) Because they are safe like a Volvo.
2) Because they are tan like a Volvo.
3) Because they look like a Volvo.
Squared and boxy.
Eight out of ten Volvo owners surveyed prefer AI.
Attachments
I stand corrected: out with the pedestrian tan and in with tricked out green Volvos
and racy AI’s! 
Ditto what Covertnoob5 said. I've seen a lot of military guys come out and really struggle at first. It just takes a little time to "unlearn" what's been beat into your head and muscle memory, and approach the shot/engagement from a different perspective.
Another Army sniper made a comment to me at SHC 2015 (his first PRS style match) that always stuck in my memory. He said:
"As a sniper, we stack every advantage we can in our favor by choosing the time, position and location of the shot. This game is kicking my ass because you literally have no control over anything, but taking the shot that's presented to you. This is a totally different approach than what I was taught."
This type of tactical long range shooting is just a different way (and some would say, more modern) to approach engaging long range targets under stress. Keep at it, and it'll all come together...
For those that like to make the statement "I'm not into playing a game, so I could care less about PRS and bolt lift", I would caution that kind of mindset as well. Is PRS/NRL a game? Absolutely. Has it become riddled with contrived stage CoFs? Absolutely. And to be clear, I agree as well.
But....Let's not throw out the baby with the bathwater. PRS/NRL style matches have pushed the art of tactical long range shooting decades farther than it would have advanced otherwise. Were we to continue to follow the ingrained dogma of military and LE TTP's for long range shooting, we'd all still be shooting Rem 700's in .308. Instead, today we have better cartridges, better stocks/chassis (remember when chassis were the "new" craze?), more adjustability, and shit, just the sheer number of options available would have beena wet dream 20 years ago. It has changed that much...all due to this "stupid, contrived, game".
AI's have always been (up until the AT-X) geared for duty weapons of LE and military shooters. Even now, that is their primary market. But even AI has had to up their game based on what the competitive community has been doing, based on experimenting and "gaming" the matches.
Is the gaming annoying as hell? Hell yes. I see it every month at our local club matches. But it has also been a forcing function of sorts, constantly pushing the boundaries on the "state of the possible".
I think the main reason most people who own AI's today, own them because of their ruggedness and reliability. Yes, that gap has closed as well...but there is still a gap. In harsh, austere conditions (IMHO) there is still nothing as robust or reliable as an AI. It's literally part of it's DNA. That being said, it's DNA does not include PRS. It is a useable system, and is competitive, but it just isn't a made-for-task PRS rifle.
That being said, I'll still take an AI over a custom. I'm past being able to compete at a competitive level. Age, injuries and disabilities have set that ship to sail. But, the one thing I still value, like most military people who have had to put trust in the gear they have when put in harm's way, is rugged reliability and very good accuracy. And that (I believe) is why so many here own them.
And yes, I own two, along with a bunch of custom and factory rifles. <shrug> They all have a place in my safe, and a task/role that they excel at.
Dry fire. A lot. (with your step ladder for different heights )
Shoot more matches. I learn something at every one. try and squad with good shooters so you can learn.
The online training here is also very helpful.
Private instruction / classes are also helpful
Here's another "Why AI?". The check riser mechanism broke on my AT-X Monday and Tuesday. I called Mile High and had a brief conversation, and they directed me to AINA. I called Tim at AI and had a FedEx label minutes afterward. I was notified that they had fixed the part and would ship it today. I've got an event on Sunday I wanted to use my rifle at, so I asked if they could find out how much express shipping would be, and the reply was that they were shipping it overnight delivery.
That kind of service is why I AI.
That kind of service is why I AI.
7 axis manual mill you mean!Maybe a dremel was involved....
@4O6shootist using PRS / NRL for your basis is flawed logic. It’s a game. More or less Benchrest / F Class than tactical in todays matches. But if you are using this logic; Jorge Ortiz, Rhett Walters, Jonathan Roberts, and Ryan Castle have all won PRS/NRL matches with AIs. I am sure I am forgetting a few. Don’t forget the granddaddy of them all Jacob Bynum.
No team in the sport can hang with Sean Murphy and Greg Hamilton. Real World Sniper, Guardian, Sniper’s Unknown, Competition Dynamics, etc. Guess what Sean runs? An AI ATX. What do you see more teams running at USASOC? In real life / field matches you see more AI’s. There is a reason for that.
I can’t tell you how many times I have seen, from people who compete in the AG cup, failure to feed, failure to fire, or failure to eject. Throw into the mix all the other average Joe’s at a match and it’s concerning / laughable. I have never once had a failure to feed, eject, or fire from an AI.
I run an AI for reliability. Never had to cover it up during downpours, never had to worry about dirt getting in the action and junking it up, never had to worry about the mags getting dirty or where my rounds sit in the mag, etc. it just flat out runs.
People who run AI’s are more concerned with the rifleman mentality than games.
No team in the sport can hang with Sean Murphy and Greg Hamilton. Real World Sniper, Guardian, Sniper’s Unknown, Competition Dynamics, etc. Guess what Sean runs? An AI ATX. What do you see more teams running at USASOC? In real life / field matches you see more AI’s. There is a reason for that.
I can’t tell you how many times I have seen, from people who compete in the AG cup, failure to feed, failure to fire, or failure to eject. Throw into the mix all the other average Joe’s at a match and it’s concerning / laughable. I have never once had a failure to feed, eject, or fire from an AI.
I run an AI for reliability. Never had to cover it up during downpours, never had to worry about dirt getting in the action and junking it up, never had to worry about the mags getting dirty or where my rounds sit in the mag, etc. it just flat out runs.
People who run AI’s are more concerned with the rifleman mentality than games.
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I started precision shooting about 5 years ago and my first bolt gun is a RPR in 308 and I still have it. After about 1 year I bought a Tikka T3X TAC A1 in 6.5CM and then a 308. Those are all fine rifles but I find that I need to feed match ammo to those rifles to get sub MOA groups. Another 2 years later, I bought my first AI AX and the Barrett MRAD in the same year. The biggest improvement I get from those two higher-end rifles are I can easily get sub-moa rifles with training ammo like 308 Norma Tactical 150 grain or 149 grain. I have not shot my first match yet but I do enjoy shooting and training. Being able to test myself using just cheap factory ammo is very rewarding. I have not shot the RPR or Tikka's since I got the AI AX and MRAD even though I still own them.
I briefly had an AT but sold it pretty quickly since the ergonomics weren't for me. Also the AW magazine that was included with it would let a 6.5CM round pop loose if I didn't put the magazine in the rifle very slowly/carefully. So I'd most of the time insert the magazine and immediately have to fish out a loose round. But that was just a magazine issue.
I do wonder with how far custom actions such as Impact/Lone Peak have come, how much people are actually losing in a reliability sense when they use those instead of an AI. I don't think the gap between the two is nearly as big now.
I do wonder with how far custom actions such as Impact/Lone Peak have come, how much people are actually losing in a reliability sense when they use those instead of an AI. I don't think the gap between the two is nearly as big now.
It's not a matter of money... I can buy whatever I want, but I'm not spending $10K on an MOA rifle so I can LARP like some armchair sniper wannabe who plays Call of Duty. You're simply buying a name at this point. A relic of the past, that symbolized a time when cheaper rifles were inferior, and it took lots of money to have a precision long range capable weapon. But at this point in rifle technology, you can build a nicer, and more superior precision long range rifle for about half of an AI without all the stupid proprietary and overpriced parts...Same goes for DesertTech and Barrett. Are they nice? Sure. But ridiculously overpriced for what you get.
But by all means, go right ahead and waste your money so you can feel special.
Yes yes let the remington 700 flow thru you. Join me on the 700 side.It's not a matter of money... I can buy whatever I want, but I'm not spending $10K on an MOA rifle so I can LARP like some armchair sniper wannabe who plays Call of Duty. You're simply buying a name at this point. A relic of the past, that symbolized a time when cheaper rifles were inferior, and it took lots of money to have a precision long range capable weapon. But at this point in rifle technology, you can build a nicer, and more superior precision long range rifle for about half of an AI without all the stupid proprietary and overpriced parts...Same goes for DesertTech and Barrett. Are they nice? Sure. But ridiculously overpriced for what you get.
But by all means, go right ahead and waste your money so you can feel special.
The M40 is superior! Reject modernity! Stay with tradition!
Good young padawon
I have owned a few AIs and liked them all. I currently have an ATX and use it to compete casually, I also use it for predator hunting and varmint shooting and general long range shooting.
Aftermarket R700 clones have come a long ways in the last decade but at least for me they too often require “ tinkering “ to run.
I like the whole system, reliability, durability, AW mags that actually run, quick change barrels available everywhere, etc.
I don’t think it’s ideal for current PRS but that is a very specialized field in it’s current iteration.
Alot of verbal diarrhea that speaks more about you than the rifle. Let's see, if you own an AI it's to larp, AI are only good for moa, blah blah blah. So what do you consider that is just as good, shoots ad good, and is equal in reliability in all conditions? I can't wait for this answer. I've had rem and Tikka triggers shit the bed, never had an issue with an AI trigger. Had the bolt stop shear off of a Tikka and the plastic bolt shroud broke and fell off. I've had custom rifles that need feed lips tweaked and mag release height altered, stocks needed bedded, fp break inside 2k rds, ejections issues in an origin, triggers lock up on cocking piece(requiring the trigger to be removed to open bolt. Funny thing is, never had any of that shit happen to my AIs. Apparently you have an issue with AIs, don't know why and don't really care. You take it to personal level, did an AI rifle steal your high school girlfriend or something?It's not a matter of money... I can buy whatever I want, but I'm not spending $10K on an MOA rifle so I can LARP like some armchair sniper wannabe who plays Call of Duty. You're simply buying a name at this point. A relic of the past, that symbolized a time when cheaper rifles were inferior, and it took lots of money to have a precision long range capable weapon. But at this point in rifle technology, you can build a nicer, and more superior precision long range rifle for about half of an AI without all the stupid proprietary and overpriced parts...Same goes for DesertTech and Barrett. Are they nice? Sure. But ridiculously overpriced for what you get.
But by all means, go right ahead and waste your money so you can feel special.
I simply stated my opinion, and you're the one who actually took it to heart to write all that shit out (speaking of word-salad verbal diarrhea)... I don't have any personal issue with AI. I didn't take any of it personal, but you sure as hell did judging by all your shrieking butthurt. I couldn't give less of a shit about a Tikka. And 700's are the lowest rung on my personal list of custom rifle build actions to choose from. Savage and many others are just garbage that I will never own, or recommend to anyone.
To be fair about this thread after owning 2 AXMC’s, an AT/AO and currently just an ATX and customs; my ATX hasn’t been shot in over a year. It isn’t bad but the bolt lift sucks compared to my CDG and Curtis, the comp trigger in my previous AT/AO failed, twice. Thankfully not in my ATX tho. Never had a diamond go down (I have seen it tho). And I’ve definitely seen ATX’s not feed. Let’s not forget the issues early adopters were having with mags. AI did a great job replacing them sure but it wasn’t 100% out the box for many. I think once upon a time AI’s were the pinnacle of reliability sure. Especially the OG trigger. Now tho there’s so many good options that are equal in reliability that that argument shouldn’t hold much water anymore. If you want an AI cause it looks cool, sounds cool, has a good heritage, or a myriad of other reasons then by all means get one. I think the logo looks cool asf and I do appreciate the lineage, but I’d never tell anyone to get one because it’s unequivocally more reliable than a good custom. That’s not being 100% truthful.
The thing with AI is the more they venture from their tried and true reputation of military grade, reliable, tank like rifles the worse it seems to get
But that’s what happens when you try to adapt to a new sport that takes ahold of the shooting world like prs.
PRS (I don’t shoot it) has brought a plethora of new technologies to rifles in just the past 5 years. That’s across the board. Chassis, triggers, prefits and actions.
The days of quick change barrel used to be an AI or Savage in your garage with a barrel nut and action wrench.
As the shooting world like prs demands better everything on a constant basis AI was forced to adopt things like the comp trigger and the ATX rifles and chassis. Then everyone tried to run a 6mm variant and mags became the issue
If you want to run standard cartridges like many do. The 308, 300 or 338 etc then AI is still a very good choice and reliability is excellent. The others will be as we’ll eventually but it takes some time to iron them out
Meanwhile the prices just go so high up that most guys shooting prs wouldn’t even consider it anyways. Especially with new ATXC pricing
In today’s market if you demand higher prices you’ll have to offer something that not everyone else does at a much lower price point. As stated above modern rifles are very reliable and it’s no longer a world or R700, Savage, Tikka or AI. Being able to swap parts at leisure is a big draw for many especially in the gun game market. Buy and try is a regular thing now days
That said my AT is my favorite rifle I’ve owned and I’ve owned many
But that’s what happens when you try to adapt to a new sport that takes ahold of the shooting world like prs.
PRS (I don’t shoot it) has brought a plethora of new technologies to rifles in just the past 5 years. That’s across the board. Chassis, triggers, prefits and actions.
The days of quick change barrel used to be an AI or Savage in your garage with a barrel nut and action wrench.
As the shooting world like prs demands better everything on a constant basis AI was forced to adopt things like the comp trigger and the ATX rifles and chassis. Then everyone tried to run a 6mm variant and mags became the issue
If you want to run standard cartridges like many do. The 308, 300 or 338 etc then AI is still a very good choice and reliability is excellent. The others will be as we’ll eventually but it takes some time to iron them out
Meanwhile the prices just go so high up that most guys shooting prs wouldn’t even consider it anyways. Especially with new ATXC pricing
In today’s market if you demand higher prices you’ll have to offer something that not everyone else does at a much lower price point. As stated above modern rifles are very reliable and it’s no longer a world or R700, Savage, Tikka or AI. Being able to swap parts at leisure is a big draw for many especially in the gun game market. Buy and try is a regular thing now days
That said my AT is my favorite rifle I’ve owned and I’ve owned many
Meh. I haven’t had any issues with 308/65cm/6cm/22cm
Pipsqueak 6br etc might have issues.
Vocal AI haters are like the guys that won’t shut up about hating gays.
They have a burning desire for it
Pretty sure you clearly said AIs can only shoot moa, that stupidity should clearly dismiss anything you have to say, and it does with me. My point, in decades of shooting, my only failures have involved non-AI rifles. My experience with AIs directly contradicts your stupid ass opinion. I stand by what I said, you obviously have an issue with AI or AI owners, I couldnt care less, I'm done with you.
Oh no! Some random internet douche says he’s “done with me”…Whatever will I do? How can I go on living without his approval of my opinions?
The amount of butthurt here is astronomically (and hilariously) astounding.
I had to go hug my AI, she doesnt like it when people say mean things about her.
On another note, I wonder why the newer guns have such a shitty bolt lift? This is a 2009 AW.
On another note, I wonder why the newer guns have such a shitty bolt lift? This is a 2009 AW.
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- Nov 3, 2010
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