.22 br

#201
Birddog, what is the “correct” reamer dimension/neck bushing size then given that I don’t want to turn necks?

I’ve seen .255 thrown around a lot in the thread, but then you said .252 gives you no issues. I would be using the same sizing process with initial neck-down and then mandrel.
 
#202
Pretty sure mine's a .255", but I'd have to look at my notes.
I don't turn, but I do get the sized-down-donut. They chamber pretty tight the first couple firings and eventually form out.
I have wondered about it's effect on consistent neck thickness.
 
#204
just browsing said:
Birddog, what is the “correct” reamer dimension/neck bushing size then given that I don’t want to turn necks?

I’ve seen .255 thrown around a lot in the thread, but then you said .252 gives you no issues. I would be using the same sizing process with initial neck-down and then mandrel.
Click to expand...

I had a .252 neck dimension reamer initially. The rifle shot like hell and it took some time to figure out the cause. I had ordered a .255 neck, so I got the wrong one. The only way to make the .252 neck work is to neck turn your brass. Which as I've stated, I won't do. I lose this brass and wear it out shooting PRS matches, so I refuse to invest all that time into brass prep and be frustrated when I lose 10 to 12 (or more) pieces of it at every big match. And, I hate neck turning.

Manson took care of me, seeing as how we were both at fault, they split the new reamer cost with me and I now have a .2555 neck dimension reamer. I resize with a .249 bushing, which gives me an internal diameter of around .220/.221. I run the .222 mandrel down it, and as mentioned, that gives me .002 neck tension and a .252 OD.
 
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#205
Soooo.....
I couldn't hunt the TN rifle opener this weekend. Family stuff. Long story.
I wanted a coyote load for the .22BR, and I'm not doing anything else today, so here we go.
I figured I could leave everything zero'ed for 95SMK's, take good notes, run the turrets to POA/POI with whatever load I'm shooting coyotes with, skate the reticle for any dogs way out there (way out there being 4-500 yards where I'm at) and rock on.

I stuffed a 75 grain A-Max (have the better part of a box) over 32 grains of LeveRevolution, chrony said 3245fps (24" barrel, 9" suppressor), seems like plenty. Think I'll work up a ladder from about 30.6-32 and run it over my Buddy's magnetospeed and go from there.

My next question, and I think I know the answer (but I can't quit thinking about it), does anyone think a 53 grain V-Max at 3500 or so would survive the trip out of my 7 twist barrel? These shoot swimmingly out of my 16" AR (8 twist, at 3000fps). I think they'll have a come apart, but has anyone tried it? Thinking around 31-32 grains of TAC would be the ticket. Any opinions?

We're not saving hides, btw. However, we do like flying fur, red mist, mushroom clouds, etc............

Edited to add: I tried a 53 over 31grn TAC. I took the suppressor off (didn't figure a bullet flying apart inside of it would help it any), it clocked 3507fps. Made a large hole in the pumpkin behind the chrony (like, way bigger than the 75).

Hmmmm..........
 
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#206
While not a 22BR my Grendel IMP is same neighborhood capacity/performance .....

I think the Vmax is thinner jacketed than 53 Nosler but have pushed Nosler over 3900 fps from a 27" 7 twist AR and 27" 8 twist bolt gun with good accuracy to 600 yds, furthest i have tested 53 gr to date.
 
#207
Potsy said:
Soooo.....

I couldn't hunt the TN rifle opener this weekend. Family stuff. Long story.

I wanted a coyote load for the .22BR, and I'm not doing anything else today, so here we go.

I figured I could leave everything zero'ed for 95SMK's, take good notes, run the turrets to POA/POI with whatever load I'm shooting coyotes with, skate the reticle for any dogs way out there (way out there being 4-500 yards where I'm at) and rock on.


I stuffed a 75 grain A-Max (have the better part of a box) over 32 grains of LeveRevolution, chrony said 3245fps (24" barrel, 9" suppressor), seems like plenty. Think I'll work up a ladder from about 30.6-32 and run it over my Buddy's magnetospeed and go from there.


My next question, and I think I know the answer (but I can't quit thinking about it), does anyone think a 53 grain V-Max at 3500 or so would survive the trip out of my 7 twist barrel? These shoot swimmingly out of my 16" AR (8 twist, at 3000fps). I think they'll have a come apart, but has anyone tried it? Thinking around 31-32 grains of TAC would be the ticket. Any opinions?


We're not saving hides, btw. However, we do like flying fur, red mist, mushroom clouds, etc............


Edited to add: I tried a 53 over 31grn TAC. I took the suppressor off (didn't figure a bullet flying apart inside of it would help it any), it clocked 3507fps. Made a large hole in the pumpkin behind the chrony (like, way bigger than the 75).


Hmmmm..........
Click to expand...


I would run the numbers based off of the distance you are thinking you are going to shoot. If you are going to be shooting past a few hundred yards the extra speed bleeds off quick with the light low b.c. bullets. The 75gr and 88gr elds in my 22 Creed out perform the lighter bullets in every way past 300yds. Closer than that the drop is around .2 mil more which isn't much difference.
 
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#208
Will probably punt and run the 75's for a few reasons:

-I counted and have 43 of them, which will leave me with 36 loaded after the ladder test. That'll likely last me a bit. Then, if I like them, I'll start looking for a box of 75 ELD's (good luck...)
-I MIGHT want to sluice a deer, which I'd be a lot more comfy putting a 75 between a deer's ribs than a 53Vmax.
-Assuming expansion down to 1800fps for either bullet, the 75 got me to about 700 yards, around 550 for the 53. Both are likely way further than I'll shoot.

Probably picking nits. But I'm gonna roll with it for the time being. Still might run a ladder with the 53's anyway, just to see WTF........
 
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#209
Potsy said:
Soooo.....
I couldn't hunt the TN rifle opener this weekend. Family stuff. Long story.
I wanted a coyote load for the .22BR, and I'm not doing anything else today, so here we go.
I figured I could leave everything zero'ed for 95SMK's, take good notes, run the turrets to POA/POI with whatever load I'm shooting coyotes with, skate the reticle for any dogs way out there (way out there being 4-500 yards where I'm at) and rock on.

I stuffed a 75 grain A-Max (have the better part of a box) over 32 grains of LeveRevolution, chrony said 3245fps (24" barrel, 9" suppressor), seems like plenty. Think I'll work up a ladder from about 30.6-32 and run it over my Buddy's magnetospeed and go from there.

My next question, and I think I know the answer (but I can't quit thinking about it), does anyone think a 53 grain V-Max at 3500 or so would survive the trip out of my 7 twist barrel? These shoot swimmingly out of my 16" AR (8 twist, at 3000fps). I think they'll have a come apart, but has anyone tried it? Thinking around 31-32 grains of TAC would be the ticket. Any opinions?

We're not saving hides, btw. However, we do like flying fur, red mist, mushroom clouds, etc............

Edited to add: I tried a 53 over 31grn TAC. I took the suppressor off (didn't figure a bullet flying apart inside of it would help it any), it clocked 3507fps. Made a large hole in the pumpkin behind the chrony (like, way bigger than the 75).

Hmmmm..........
Click to expand...
I loaded up 15 of the 53gr V Max over Varget and got them up to 3595 fps. Shot the first 5 at 100 without a suppressor or brake. They all made it to the target, so I put the suppressor and Magneto on and shot a plate at 416 yards. They hit hard, but I bet they splash on impact om a coyote. If I use it, I will stick with the 88gr ELDM.
 
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#210
I whacked one last year with an 88 (at 3000fps), just over 100 yards right through the top of the shoulders. It died right there, but the only sign it had been shot was a drop of blood on the far side.
I shot a bigger one a couple weeks ago with my AR, same range (a pretty pedestrian load of 25grns of H335 and a 55grn Hornady soft point, runs about 2900fps out of my 16" barrel), and it left a fairly nasty exit hole on another shoulder shot. That put me to thinkin'.

Like I said, I'll stick with the 75 flay-Maxes (if they work well, eventually 75 ELD-M's), but I'd bet those 53's would be pure hell on a groundhog!!!!
Gonna try to run a ladder with the 75's sometime this week.......
 
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#211
Little over a month ago i shot prairie dogs with 88 ELDM and 53 gr Nosler VG ....
53 gr @ 3650 from 22" 14 twist AR or 3700 from 24" 7 twist would flat vaporize a dog 200 yd or under! Some, shrapnel was 10 -12 ft high!

Used the 88's from 7 twist over 200 as winds were up to 18 mph.
88 wasnt near as destuctive but to be expected...
But enough to see results... one was standing 430 yd , shot straight up like a rocket on impact.
Have shot lots of yotes with 53 gr out of a 22 250 @3850fps ... same as if they were struck with lightning , never an exit other than small fragments of jacket or bone.

Only one with 88/3000 so far.... it died immediatly but nothing spectacular. So both work but on windy days or long shots the heavies win everytime.

I do believe the Vmax's are more explosive than the nosler , buddy shot couple yotes with them in 22 250, they died but not immediately with good shot placement.....
 
#212
The 53 V-Maxes do shoot very well out of my AR (.223). 26.0grns of TAC runs 3000fps. Did a "ladder" and the better "node" is at 26.3 for 3050fps, which is what I'll load next. I had intended on carrying that load on that last coyote outing, but I had left them at home so the 55SPT's were what I had with me. The 55's about as plain as a fence post with the B.C. of a ping pong ball, but they have, for a sample of one, lived up to their reputation as killers.

The AR is handier, and would likely do whatever I need done, but I sooooo love shooting my .22BR...........
 
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#213
I know what you mean, 22 BR performance is about optimum IMO for a 22 cal.
Not horrible barrel burner or bullet exploder from too much velocity/RPM.
Interest in AR platform over last year led me to the creation of my 22 Grendel IMP chambering to get 22BR performance from AR.

Was going to build a 22BR bolt gun .... until i built the AR and to keep things simplier just chamber 2 bolt guns so can use same brass, dies etc.

LOL, about all the 50 and 55 gr 22 cal bullets have a b.c. of ping pong (i say bowling ball) amd what led me to the 53's in 12 and 14 twist barrels.
One thing nice about the Noslers being flat base is they stabilize in all 14 twist barrels i have tried... the Vmax some will some wont stabilize them. Flat base usually increases short range (100 -300 yd accuracy.
They shoot bugholes in my rifles....
 
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#219
New 22BR coming together 85A8C7D7-6A5D-491B-9D27-286467577356.jpegB6C27C64-CF09-40A4-8EF3-39D08DC41186.jpegC7DED73A-1405-4071-8719-4EAD3431B2E0.jpeg1CD57630-C865-4276-94B8-974CE22AC37E.jpeg5C95CFC1-01CD-4E0B-B7E4-5D7F82F17B70.jpeg
 
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#221
All depends on what bullets you choose to shoot.
My 7 twist barrels shoot 40 to 88 gr no problem.
Have shot 53 gr Noslers at 3900+ fps out to 575 yds without bullet coming apart and great accuracy. Have not shot lots of them and barrels only have couple hundres rnds on them sooo.....
 
#222
ES 350 said:
All depends on what bullets you choose to shoot.
My 7 twist barrels shoot 40 to 88 gr no problem.
Have shot 53 gr Noslers at 3900+ fps out to 575 yds without bullet coming apart and great accuracy. Have not shot lots of them and barrels only have couple hundres rnds on them sooo.....
Click to expand...
Plan on shooting the 85.5 Berger.


Has anyone shot a 22 dasher and went back to a 22 BR?
 
#224
Ive read through as much as I can but I think maybe I missed if anyone has measured the grains of H2O?
Im going to be running petersons brass and I see most here are using Lapua so may be close to what Im using. QL says 36gr but if your using 32+gr of r16 Im thinking real life volume is going to have to be closer to 38gr of H2O? Ill be starting my build this week yet so hope to be pulling the trigger this weekend.
 
#225
I asked awhile back on h20 capacity....

Researching the net i have found #'s of 38 -38.5 for 22BR but no actual measured #'s.

Looking at Nosler 22 BR data and with same bullet seated to same OAL my Grendel IMP case was .5 gr less capacity than nosler 22 BR #'s (early test and brass has grown with more firings) although Nosler was different brand of brass....

My Grendel IMP case holds 37.5 gr of H20.
Without testing a case from your specific chamber correct #'s for your rifle will not be known as reamers vary as well as seating depth will affect as loaded capacities.

To find as fired capacity, a sized case (no primer) with bullet seated at correct length for your chamber is weighed , then use syringe with needle to fill case through flash hole with H20 , tapping case to remove air bubbles, case the re weigh.
 
#226
ES 350 said:
I asked awhile back on h20 capacity....

Researching the net i have found #'s of 38 -38.5 for 22BR but no actual measured #'s.

Looking at Nosler 22 BR data and with same bullet seated to same OAL my Grendel IMP case was .5 gr less capacity than nosler 22 BR #'s (early test and brass has grown with more firings) although Nosler was different brand of brass....

My Grendel IMP case holds 37.5 gr of H20.
Without testing a case from your specific chamber correct #'s for your rifle will not be known as reamers vary as well as seating depth will affect as loaded capacities.

To find as fired capacity, a sized case (no primer) with bullet seated at correct length for your chamber is weighed , then use syringe with needle to fill case through flash hole with H20 , tapping case to remove air bubbles, case the re weigh.
Click to expand...


Thanks for the reply. I understand every chamber is different so my results will vary however I dont want to load up 50 rounds of brass to find out my first shot is over max and I need to pull bullets.
For fireforming Im starting with 33gr of CFE223 and a 69gr SMK. Im also loading a few 85gr RDFs with 30 gr of CFE223. Will I be safe or am I pushing it?
My reamer is 22br Norma, appears to be around .100fb and a 256 neck. My loaded brass have a .2525 measurment on the neck.
Once I get it up and running Ill be able to get some H2O measurments.
 
#227
I have not loaded any CFE in formed brass , have used 33 gr under a 50 gr bullet to fireform.

I have read (no personal expierience) CFE 223 and Win 748 are almost same powder.

Sierra data has some data with heavier bullets.
Screenshot_20201219-075307.jpg
 
#228
Shot a few through mine today just to get measurements. It shoots very nice, several groups under 1/2" with both 69gr SMKs and 85gr RDFs. Its showing a lot of potential so now that I have some brass ironed out I can start development.
My fireformed brass has a neck diameter of .253" so probably a .254 neck chamber? Im using a .250 bushing and a loaded round measures .252" on the neck. I may have to turn the necks but no problems yet.
I used a throating reamer to get the 88gr bullet seating "touching" at 2.34 OAL
H2O is 36.6gr (kinda short of the 38-38.5gr h2o?) Petersons brass must be really thick!.
According to QL I should be able to fit 30.5gr of R16 in the case with the 88gr ELD-m giving me 105% fill?

Anyone try H414 or Ramshot hunter yet? I might need a backup powder if R16 doesnt give me what its capable of.
 
#229
I'm running 31.7 RL-16 w/88's, but I think there's a lower node somewhere from 30.5 to 31.2. Lapua brass, btw.

I've not tried Ramshot Hunter, I only bring it up because I've been eyeballing that powder. I like the fact it should meter easy, Ramshot claims temp stability, the burn range looks good, and guys that run it in other calibers seem to love it. If I had any, I'd give it a whirl.........
 
#230
Potsy said:
I'm running 31.7 RL-16 w/88's, but I think there's a lower node somewhere from 30.5 to 31.2. Lapua brass, btw.

I've not tried Ramshot Hunter, I only bring it up because I've been eyeballing that powder. I like the fact it should meter easy, Ramshot claims temp stability, the burn range looks good, and guys that run it in other calibers seem to love it. If I had any, I'd give it a whirl.........
Click to expand...
My 6.5 creed loves it with 130gr TMKs but metering for me wasnt easy. I use a chargemaster and the spheres of ramshot powder causes it to flow a little too well. However, it goes through the powder thrower almost perfect and repeatable.
 
#231
outlawkyote said:
Shot a few through mine today just to get measurements. It shoots very nice, several groups under 1/2" with both 69gr SMKs and 85gr RDFs. Its showing a lot of potential so now that I have some brass ironed out I can start development.
My fireformed brass has a neck diameter of .253" so probably a .254 neck chamber? Im using a .250 bushing and a loaded round measures .252" on the neck. I may have to turn the necks but no problems yet.
I used a throating reamer to get the 88gr bullet seating "touching" at 2.34 OAL
H2O is 36.6gr (kinda short of the 38-38.5gr h2o?) Petersons brass must be really thick!.
According to QL I should be able to fit 30.5gr of R16 in the case with the 88gr ELD-m giving me 105% fill?

Anyone try H414 or Ramshot hunter yet? I might need a backup powder if R16 doesnt give me what its capable of.
Click to expand...

I have found that in other calibers Peterson brass is thicker than Lapua. I use 30.2 to 31.6 of Rl16 under the 88gr ELDM in Lapua brass in my 22BR. I would back off a grain in the Peterson.
 
#232
Running through my 3rd 22br now I think I’ve done more testing in this caliber than anything else I’ve shot, still trying to dial in the reamer specs right but I’m starting to fall in love with it as a shorter range prs caliber and a coyote slayer. I’ve been playing with 90 gr atips and 85.5 Bergers both are nasty on yotes and both shoot excellent. My reamer is a .256 neck with .100 fb I’ve also shot a .252 .085fb think I’ll order another at .255 with a .100 fb just to see if it seems more accurate with out the function issues of a tight neck. The .256 functions flawlessly.
 

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#233
vaughtfarms said:
Running through my 3rd 22br now I think I’ve done more testing in this caliber than anything else I’ve shot, still trying to dial in the reamer specs right but I’m starting to fall in love with it as a shorter range prs caliber and a coyote slayer. I’ve been playing with 90 gr atips and 85.5 Bergers both are nasty on yotes and both shoot excellent. My reamer is a .256 neck with .100 fb I’ve also shot a .252 .085fb think I’ll order another at .255 with a .100 fb just to see if it seems more accurate with out the function issues of a tight neck. The .256 functions flawlessly.
Click to expand...
Best twist rate ?
 
#234
vaughtfarms said:
Running through my 3rd 22br now I think I’ve done more testing in this caliber than anything else I’ve shot, still trying to dial in the reamer specs right but I’m starting to fall in love with it as a shorter range prs caliber and a coyote slayer. I’ve been playing with 90 gr atips and 85.5 Bergers both are nasty on yotes and both shoot excellent. My reamer is a .256 neck with .100 fb I’ve also shot a .252 .085fb think I’ll order another at .255 with a .100 fb just to see if it seems more accurate with out the function issues of a tight neck. The .256 functions flawlessly.
Click to expand...

Have you tried the 88ge ELDM on coyotes?
 
#235
I shot a long range steel match at Dead Zero Saturday with mine. About 20 shooters and I came in fifth. I've yet to win one, but you can't help but smile. When you beat rifles that were way more expensive, chambered in more expensive to shoot calibers (that are supposed to "buck" the wind better, cause those "little" .22's get blown around:LOL:). While the wind is usually pretty light, you're shooting into a "bowl" that the wind swirls in. Add in some inclination, and some updrafts, and it really screws with heads. I swear there were two wind flags around 600 yards at the tops of the berm, on opposite sides, each blowing the opposite direction. FWIW, I was running a 95SMK and RL-16. It was running 2,850 when I worked up the load at around 75 degrees, but 30-35 degrees colder and it was down around 2,775 or so (I will say I had my brass annealed between load workup and now, that may have been part of the issue, I thought RL16 was supposed to be more temp stable than that).

I'm pretty sure my neck's .255" and while they initially chambered a bit tight per the sizing donut (I just thought of it as a "false shoulder" and rocked on), I've not had any trouble.

I've popped one smallish coyote with mine (there's a pic of it either on this thread or on the Bighorn Origin thread). I used an 88ELD at about 3,000fps at about 120 yards. High shoulder shot. Couldn't find the entrance, just a little blood on the exit. That said, the coyote died right there. I'm working on some 75Amaxes for a 'yote load. Had a pretty good 3" cluster at 600 yards while laddering up a load a few weeks ago with H-Lever.

My 1:7" 5R 'Bart seems to get all the goody out of 75's-95's. I've fired exactly one 53Vmax through it at 3,500, all I can tell you is that it made it across the Chrony.
 
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#236
bodhisafa said:
Best twist rate ?
Click to expand...
If I was in higher DA and elevation Ide run a 7.5 twist at 3000fps +- 50 it prolly shoot the best there where I’m at with DA around 0 in the winter 7 seems like the good spot i wouldn’t go faster than 7 or slower than 7.5 prolly a gain twist from 7.5-7 would be ideal
 
#238
Potsy said:
FWIW, I was running a 95SMK and RL-16. It was running 2,850 when I worked up the load at around 75 degrees, but 30-35 degrees colder and it was down around 2,775 or so (I will say I had my brass annealed between load workup and now, that may have been part of the issue, I thought RL16 was supposed to be more temp stable than that)
Click to expand...

Is that about the limit of the 95gr bullets for you? I only ask because my 223AI runs them at 2900fps with H414 and was planning to give them a try in my BR but not if the velocity isnt there?
 
#240
I've not tried to push the 95's hard. I'm running a 24" barrel, btw.
I was running 88's around 3,000fps and figured 2,850 oughta be a safe space for 95's. Guesstimated I'd get there around 30 grains of RL16, and "laddered" from there.
3K out of a 28" tube wouldn't surprise me.
1,000 yards is as far as my range goes. Given the claimed .6 G1 (or figuring a G7 of .306) of a 95SMK, at 2,850fps, it's supersonic to 1300-1400. There's plenty of "bigger" stuff that's not putting on that good of a show.
I will say, cranked up to 3Kfps, the numbers start getting more impressive, but that's harder than I care to run it out of my rifle.
95's at 2900 out of a .223 AI sounds hot to me out of any reasonable barrel length, but if you're comfy with it, rock on. I usually figure about 250-300fps over a standard .223 when I'm swagging BR speed, so that'd put you at 3100-3200 (woo hoo!).
 
#241
Potsy said:
I've not tried to push the 95's hard. I'm running a 24" barrel, btw.
I was running 88's around 3,000fps and figured 2,850 oughta be a safe space for 95's. Guesstimated I'd get there around 30 grains of RL16, and "laddered" from there.
3K out of a 28" tube wouldn't surprise me.
1,000 yards is as far as my range goes. Given the claimed .6 G1 (or figuring a G7 of .306) of a 95SMK, at 2,850fps, it's supersonic to 1300-1400. There's plenty of "bigger" stuff that's not putting on that good of a show.
I will say, cranked up to 3Kfps, the numbers start getting more impressive, but that's harder than I care to run it out of my rifle.
95's at 2900 out of a .223 AI sounds hot to me out of any reasonable barrel length, but if you're comfy with it, rock on. I usually figure about 250-300fps over a standard .223 when I'm swagging BR speed, so that'd put you at 3100-3200 (woo hoo!).
Click to expand...
I'm running a 28.5" shillen 7t barrel and throated it till I can load an 88gr eld to 2.37".
I'm guessing I started my 22br build with +3000fps in mind with 95s but at the moment I can't find any so I'm still developing with the 88s.
After my first trip to the range I've had the 88s +3100 with r16 with a node around 3050. I think I can get another 50fps safely which hopefully there is another node to be had up there. At my elevation I think I can stay supersonic to our 1810yd steel with the 95s if i can stay above 3000?
If its not going to get me there I may have to Ackley improve it to get a small bump.
The 223ai at 2900fps is just starting to get a little squirrely at our 1520yd steel. Just hoping to get to our last gong(1810) with moa accuracy or better.
 
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#243
Was doing load development with 88gr ELDs and R16
At 895 yds was getting well under MAO accuracy. My best was 3 rounds under 3" with two in the same spot.
 

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#247
27-28 with up to an 80 will be ok but I doubt you’ll come close to 3300 maybe 3150 ish I did 27.5 with a 80.5 in a 26” it was 3110 and starting to pressure
 
#248
22br kills
 

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#249
Yotetalker said:
Running through my 3rd 22br now I think I’ve done more testing in this caliber than anything else I’ve shot, still trying to dial in the reamer specs right but I’m starting to fall in love with it as a shorter range prs caliber and a coyote slayer. I’ve been playing with 90 gr atips and 85.5 Bergers both are nasty on yotes and both shoot excellent. My reamer is a .256 neck with .100 fb I’ve also shot a .252 .085fb think I’ll order another at .255 with a .100 fb just to see if it seems more accurate with out the function issues of a tight neck. The .256 functions flawlessly.
Click to expand...
I just ordered a .256 neck 100fb from jgs
I have 85.5s and 88s
What are you loading and getting for speed/accuracy?
 
#250
Strike_out said:
I just ordered a .256 neck 100fb from jgs
I have 85.5s and 88s
What are you loading and getting for speed/accuracy?
Click to expand...
Running 85.5 Berger’s with 32 gr of r16 or 32.5 of h4350 or 28.5 of varget has all yielded between 3000 and 3050 FPS all the loads seed to shoot about the same .5moa or better at 100 holds .5moa out to 800 under good conditions. Cci450s 26” proof barrels suppressed Has been taking around 300 rds and a few firings on the brass for it to all Settle in Nicely I’ve had some really good results out of th r16 load and the bullet about .040” off the lands. It runs right at 3030fps with great numbers
 
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