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300 PRC update
- Thread starter DAVETOOLEY
- Start date
@fmillik
Check out berger’s stability calculator. (Screen shots below)
Even at the low velocity of 2650 it says you’re still stable. Can’t imagine you’ll have trouble hitting higher velocities than that with a 205gr and 26” barrel even with conservative loading.
Check out berger’s stability calculator. (Screen shots below)
Even at the low velocity of 2650 it says you’re still stable. Can’t imagine you’ll have trouble hitting higher velocities than that with a 205gr and 26” barrel even with conservative loading.
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Yeah, I’ve been playing around with the Berger calculator. I don’t see myself going beyond 220 grains.
Thanks for your help guys.
Here’s a link to Dave Tooley’s experience:
300 PRC update
I went ahead with a 9 twist for the one LRI is building up for me. Got notice earlier of test firing so hopefully cerakote and shipping out soon so i can see how she works.
www.snipershide.com
My 9 twist shoots the 250's just fine...however....the 230's are a better bullet for the 300PRC. I soooo wanted the 250.....the BC is nice....but the 230's were just better for me in almost every way from 1 mile to 2400+ yards.
@fmillik The 9.5 twist will work for what you want. Generally it has been much easier to find a 9 twist in stock.....just curious as to why you went 9.5? But yea...it will work for what you want to do...and do it well.
Is the old Gunwerks 7lrm the same brass as the 300 prc? Can a person just run the 30 cal expander ball (just like we made 338 edge brass out of 300 Ultra brass) through it and make the same thing??? Thanks for any help... Dave
I'm using the Sinclair .306 carbide neck turning mandrel and it seems to work fine for me.
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Im in the process of getting a 300PRC barrel for my archimedes action. My question is.
Am I better off getting a pre-fit or having a blank chambered?
I should have a proof ss 30 cal blank next month that I was going to get chambered for my 300WM. It will be replacing my bartlein. I was looking at getting a pre-fit bartlein chambered in 300PRC from StraightJacket Armory. I am undecided right now.
What are the pros and cons of pre-fit barrels?
Am I better off getting a pre-fit or having a blank chambered?
I should have a proof ss 30 cal blank next month that I was going to get chambered for my 300WM. It will be replacing my bartlein. I was looking at getting a pre-fit bartlein chambered in 300PRC from StraightJacket Armory. I am undecided right now.
What are the pros and cons of pre-fit barrels?
Since you are comparing prefit to shouldered I’m assuming you mean a threaded pre fit (I.e savage, remage) with a barrel nut.
Advantages of the barrel nut style is they are typically cheaper and they can be prefit for any action that accepts the specified thread pattern. Disadvantage they use a barrel nut and every time you change you’ll need to set your headspace.
Advantages of shouldered (prefit or not) is that it’s made specifically for your action you just torque it on and go.
Some actions, the archimedes included, are manufactured to such tight tolerance that you can purchase a shouldered prefit. Meaning the gunsmith will not need your action in hand to make a shouldered barrel for you.
Assuming both are equal quality barrels and are installed correctly I would assume there is not performance advantage to either.
Edit: Re read your post, are you asking what the difference is between having a blank chambered vs. buying a prefit shouldered barrel? If so, with an Archimedes I would say absolutely nothing is different with the exception that you reference two different brands of barrel (proof and bartlein)
Advantages of the barrel nut style is they are typically cheaper and they can be prefit for any action that accepts the specified thread pattern. Disadvantage they use a barrel nut and every time you change you’ll need to set your headspace.
Advantages of shouldered (prefit or not) is that it’s made specifically for your action you just torque it on and go.
Some actions, the archimedes included, are manufactured to such tight tolerance that you can purchase a shouldered prefit. Meaning the gunsmith will not need your action in hand to make a shouldered barrel for you.
Assuming both are equal quality barrels and are installed correctly I would assume there is not performance advantage to either.
Edit: Re read your post, are you asking what the difference is between having a blank chambered vs. buying a prefit shouldered barrel? If so, with an Archimedes I would say absolutely nothing is different with the exception that you reference two different brands of barrel (proof and bartlein)
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I did mean a shouldered prefit. I should have been a little more specific in my post.
Thank you for responding.
The 300PRC is going to be my first build and I want to make sure I get it right.
A shouldered profit from a good smith is going to be fine. There will be no detectable difference in performance.
@JBarton Good luck with the build the 300 PRC is awesome and building bolt guns might be more addicting than ARs (though a lot harder on the wallet lol).
I’ve never ordered a barrel from PVA. Almost pulled the trigger during their Black Friday, and they were very responsive and helpful the few times I called them to discuss options.
My 300 PRC barrel is a proof carbon barrel chambered and threaded by LRI. Can’t recommend those guys enough they were super accommodating and their turn around time is awesome.
I’ve never ordered a barrel from PVA. Almost pulled the trigger during their Black Friday, and they were very responsive and helpful the few times I called them to discuss options.
My 300 PRC barrel is a proof carbon barrel chambered and threaded by LRI. Can’t recommend those guys enough they were super accommodating and their turn around time is awesome.
@Defender3
How is your testing with this combo going? I have about 10 lbs of 7977 and wasn't sure it would give me the velocity I was looking for with 215/220 hybrids out of my 24" but it seems like you're getting some decent speeds.
I got an email this morning from Creedmoor Sports saying they had it in stock at $95 per 50. Before I could get off my phone and into my account, it was gone, but Creedmoor was advertising Lapua 300PRC at $152 per 100 for March.
Has anyone tried the Berger 245 EOL bullets? I have an 8 twist Proof CF that I plan on developing a load for. Going to use Hornady brass until I can get my hands on Lapua brass next year. Apologies if this has been mentioned before.
Not that this will help you, but I got some, but haven't done load dev on them yet.
Just curious what powder and velocity you are getting etc. I just ordered up a Forster FL die today. I feel like a fat kid in a candy store..just can’t wait lol
@BCX @Surly
I’m using 90.6 grains of reloder 50 and getting 2750 out of a 20” barrel.
I pushed it as high as ~92gr and ~2900 but got pretty good pressure signs and backed off. Haven’t tried any other powders yet as most have been hard to get. When I called Berger if memory serves their best estimated velocity was RL50 and N570.
I’m using 90.6 grains of reloder 50 and getting 2750 out of a 20” barrel.
I pushed it as high as ~92gr and ~2900 but got pretty good pressure signs and backed off. Haven’t tried any other powders yet as most have been hard to get. When I called Berger if memory serves their best estimated velocity was RL50 and N570.
How is the temp stability of that powder? One of the few left in the shelves.
I picked up 2lbs of N565. I plan on starting with that and see how it goes...
And where did you find this N565?...I thought I had bought ALL of it
Still got enough RL-26 to get me through the 2021 competition season.
Still got 2lbs of Retumbo if anyone wants to trade me a house or a truck for it...heh
A 230gr A-Tip in a 9 twist barrel just loves RL-26.....sometime...when you are bored...just pour out a pile of RL-26 on the work bench...and toss a 230gr A-Tip in there...and watch it swim around with a little smile on its face.
I got 200 pieces of beautiful 300PRC brass you can have....with slight primer pocket issues...you can just glue those buggers in if you need them to stay.
but yea.... ADG still keeps underestimating the demand for 300PRC brass...I keep telling them...they keep ignoring....
My Lapua brass will be here....hopefully before the Easter Bunny starts leaving eggs in my yard.
Been brainstorming on a fix for loose primer pockets. Some kind of swager or press.
Ive glued some in before and found them when it bend my decapper.
Yeah that’s my concern with my limited hornady brass reserves; I know I’m pushing them and they won’t last.
I really need to preorder/backorder some lapua brass before everywhere closes their orders if they haven’t already.
I really need to preorder/backorder some lapua brass before everywhere closes their orders if they haven’t already.
That's why I haven't thrown them away...You can actually swage up and decrease the size of the primer pocket...and then trim the inside of the flash hole to bring it back down to level...if you so choose...but the one I did...was right back to oversized the next time I fired it.
That’s interesting. I backordered it in November but I didn’t receive any indication that they have shipped it.
Haha. I stumbled across it 6 months ago. I’m guessing it works well with the 300 prc...And where did you find this N565?...I thought I had bought ALL of it
Still got enough RL-26 to get me through the 2021 competition season.
Still got 2lbs of Retumbo if anyone wants to trade me a house or a truck for it...heh
Only a select few dealers got some stock of it. So pending where you ordered it from they may have not got anything from ADG. ADG also didn't have any available on their site. I snagged 3 boxes but had to call all the dealers from the email to find one guy who had a few left.
It probably depends on what the endgame is for either rifle. I just bought a 300WM after watching numerous videos of Mark and Sam in Australia doing many comparisons between the 300WM and 300 PRC. He has found consistently that the WM rose above the PRC once he went above 220g bullets. The PRC seemed to shine better with bullets below 220g than the WM. For my needs in ELR, I chose the WM over the PRC for that reason and for the fact that you can't get ammo for the PRC and the WM is very easy to get ammo components for. But that's just my logic, if you can't get ammo, why buy the rifle?
Mark has done limited testing with the 300PRC. He has used very few powder selections. He used just a few bullet combinations and he basically got equal performance out of them.... BUT...here's the catch....his 300WM is no longer a 300WM. He's throated it longer so that he can fit modern long skinny...but heavy projectiles into that 300WM brass.
In essence what is a 300PRC? If you really want to strip down the bull shit...it's a 300WM done the way it should have been done in the first place. Get rid of the stupid belt....and in 1963 they didn't even have a clue about what ELR bullets were. It was designed with the bullet selection of the day. Now, if you stick to what the OAL of a 300WM is supposed to be...you are shoving that 200+ grain bullet so far down into the neck you barely got any bearing service for the neck to hold it in place. You got enough slop in the chamber to shake your gun and hear the cartridge clang back and forth off the sides. The 300WM was and is one hell of a cartridge...but the 300PRC is designed from the ground up...and in practice of some of us...a more superior design.
Sure...I can drop a LS-6 in a Honda and blow the doors off your stock Porsche...but it ain't a friggin Honda any more.
SO....if you go 300WM....make sure you get a long throat.....hand load...and get those big projectiles out to where they like to be....but in my opinion...it isn't a 300WM any more.
/rant
I am definitely going to keep my win mag. I love it and with my chamber am able to achieve higher speeds using 220gr and heavier bullets. Im pushing 220gr scenars close to 2900fps and couldn't be happier with the results downrange. I am going to run them (300WM & 300PRC) side by side and see which one does better across different bullet weights. The load testing and reloading process is very interesting and I enjoy it thoroughly. I am hoping that the current situation with reloading components settles down so that we can continue enjoying the sport.
What b2lee said.
The only way to get a 300wm to perform equally is with a custom reamer and single feeding your rounds.
And then it will still need to make up for the more efficient case design and 5% increase in volume the 300 prc has over the 300wm.
I like 300 win mag, I own 300 win mags, but the 300 prc is a more advanced modern version and I can’t see where a saami 300wm will ever outperform a 300 prc.
The only way to get a 300wm to perform equally is with a custom reamer and single feeding your rounds.
And then it will still need to make up for the more efficient case design and 5% increase in volume the 300 prc has over the 300wm.
I like 300 win mag, I own 300 win mags, but the 300 prc is a more advanced modern version and I can’t see where a saami 300wm will ever outperform a 300 prc.
I already am reloading for my Win Mag with 208g Bergers and the COAL is over .300" longer than SAAMI specs. But the performance projectiles in those grain weights are so much longer than normal projectiles you could never make them to be SAAMI spec because they would be so far inside the case you couldn't put any powder in them. That's one reason the chambers are so deep in the barrels because they realized performance projectiles needed different seating depths than factory projectiles.
Watch his videos comparing them. He's done the research, probably more than anyone on the planet so far. He's probably fired and tested many hundreds of rounds before he even makes each of his videos. And what you see is an unbiased testing of barrel lengths, bullet weights, etc... By trade he is an automotive engineer and a smart sumbitch. So he knows how to test and retest without skewing data or results.
So did hornady, that’s why they developed the 300 PRC. To seat heavy for caliber bullets in a standard chamber and mag load from CIP magazines. None of which 300wm can do.
There is nothing wrong with the 300wm but there is no denying that 300 prc is a better designed modern cartridge; that is more accommodating and better performing with heavy for caliber bullets.
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