7mm SAW
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Buddy of mine killed a moose at 600 yards with a 20in 7mm-08 with 162 AMAX at 2500 FPS. DRT. Shot placement is king.
I was hoping to have around 1500 ft lbs of energy. The SST will have a little more than 1400 ft/lbs at 400y.
I think the 168 Nosler Accubonds will be the best performers for what I have in mind, but I figured I’d get to know the rifle with all the other bullets first since it is really hard to find Nosler bullets in 7mm.
I have the Hornady 162 gr SSTs, Hornady Cx in 150 gr, Hornady Eldx in 150gr, Swift Scirocco 150gr, Barnes TTSX in 150 and the Noslers to test.
My local range goes out to 400 y, I’m using a simple 12oz 2-10x scope, and I find that around 500 yards wind becomes too unpredictable for me for shooting at game.
I think the 168 Nosler Accubonds will be the best performers for what I have in mind, but I figured I’d get to know the rifle with all the other bullets first since it is really hard to find Nosler bullets in 7mm.
I have the Hornady 162 gr SSTs, Hornady Cx in 150 gr, Hornady Eldx in 150gr, Swift Scirocco 150gr, Barnes TTSX in 150 and the Noslers to test.
My local range goes out to 400 y, I’m using a simple 12oz 2-10x scope, and I find that around 500 yards wind becomes too unpredictable for me for shooting at game.
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Having a rifle built in 7 SAW. Pretty excited to start loading for it. Will be used as a PRS and hunting rig for me.
Virgin alpha brass and 162eldms with 44 grains of h4350 for break in. I would say it’s going pretty well for a pretty light load.
Well guys I’ve ran in to a couple of issues with my 7 SAW. First is that my fired brass gets these rings after sizing in my Redding dies. Even with generous die wax, it shakes my entire bench to even be able to size one piece. The rings may come from a chamber issue but that is not yet confirmed, I am getting a borescope tomorrow to check that out. The second issue being that my Redding die is over sizing and has a bad interior finish. I ran a Virgin piece of brass through the die and it left all types of scratches and looks like it sized the body. Here are pictures of the brass. However my 7 SAW loading will come to a halt for now. I will use what I have left to shoot a match next weekend but now I have to wait for Redding to make it right. Has anyone else had these issues with their Redding die set?
I had the same problem with a forester die, but never Redding. I’m sure they will make it right, they have always had good CS from my experience.
What powder are you using? I still haven't decided on a barrel length, but looking to get minimum 2700 fps with 168gr bergers. 2600 with a 162 in an 18.5" barrel is pretty awesome.
For anyone interested in 180 berger data. I did a pressure and velocity test with H4350. I think I will press up to 45 grains and see what can be done. 26” barrel.
I had been using N540, but I’ve switched to Varget. I got better speed with N540 without pressure, but I didn’t have the consistency I was hoping for.
I’m using LRP brass, so you should be able to squeeze a little more out of it with SRP. I’m using the cartridge for hunting in cold areas, so I didn’t want to worry about ignition.
I have some 168 gr Nosler ABLR that I’ll be trying later this month.
Beautiful SAW. My experience with SST bullets 117s has be less than stellar in killing quickly on whitetail (25-06). Probably not a factor in 162s.My SAW will be ready by June.
Thanks for your insight.
I don’t plan on using the SST for hunting. Mostly breaking in barrel and getting a feel for the rifle. (They are the cheapest bullets I’ve been able to find in 160+ gr).
I have a lot of different bullet profiles that I’m trying, but I plan on using either eldx or bonded bullets on game. If I get a monolithic to shoot well, I’d also go with that.
In many ways, with the shorter barrel and smaller cartridge, I’m somewhat underpowered for elk (my target animal) so I hope to make up for it with bullet construction & shot placement.
I don’t have my rifle yet.
Maybe take measurements before and after sizing of length, length to datum point( headspace), neck diameter, and web diameter. Before you use your die, disassemble and clean with bore solvent and brush .
Good luck.
I’ve been using converted Alpha 7-08 brass with LRPs for load development since I didn’t have any SRPs.
The other day I found some GM205M and started loading Alpha’s 7-SAW brass and so far all of my small rifle primers are cratered.
With LRPs, I’ve never seen a cratered primer before.
I haven’t seen any other indication of too much pressure.
For 162 eldx, I loaded 41.6 grs of Varget. And for 168 ABLR, I started at 41 grs of Varget.
These were at the bottom of my ladder, but I didn’t go any higher with either.
I’m looking for 2600 FPS with the 162 eldx out of a 18.5” barrel, which would require 41.7grs of Varget.
I haven’t been able to get the ABLR to shoot well enough, so I think I’m done with them.
What do you guys think the pressure?
The other day I found some GM205M and started loading Alpha’s 7-SAW brass and so far all of my small rifle primers are cratered.
With LRPs, I’ve never seen a cratered primer before.
I haven’t seen any other indication of too much pressure.
For 162 eldx, I loaded 41.6 grs of Varget. And for 168 ABLR, I started at 41 grs of Varget.
These were at the bottom of my ladder, but I didn’t go any higher with either.
I’m looking for 2600 FPS with the 162 eldx out of a 18.5” barrel, which would require 41.7grs of Varget.
I haven’t been able to get the ABLR to shoot well enough, so I think I’m done with them.
What do you guys think the pressure?
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@fmillik, I have not used my Hornady 7 saw die yet but that does seem odd. I’m assuming you used case lube?
I have a 22” PROOF carbon I’m shooting suppressed. Saw II chamber.
41.2 grs of Varget yielded me:
Avg 2686 FPS ES of 7 , SD of 2.8. (7 shots) with the 162 ELD-M, hope that helps. COAL of 2.899 seemed good, it liked that seating depth.
I was still getting a bit of cratering and slightly heavy bolt lift towards the end of that string. I’ll probably drop to 41.1 grs and call it good. I’m not getting the velocity that Clay has on the WTO website for that barrel length/ load combo without a little pressure. Clay mentioned to me that some PROOF barrels trend a bit slow.
Animals won’t know the difference and it shoots really well in Virgin Alpha brass. I’m hoping pressure will be lower in once fired brass.
As for your cratering, if you’re not getting heavy bolt lift or extractor swipe on case head you’re PROBABLY good. I’m pressure averse though, see it cause problems too often in real conditions.
Seems like CCI 450’s crater on me fairly often in different calibers, even with mild loads. Maybe it’s my action too, running Terminus Zeus and Apollo lite.
I have a 22” PROOF carbon I’m shooting suppressed. Saw II chamber.
41.2 grs of Varget yielded me:
Avg 2686 FPS ES of 7 , SD of 2.8. (7 shots) with the 162 ELD-M, hope that helps. COAL of 2.899 seemed good, it liked that seating depth.
I was still getting a bit of cratering and slightly heavy bolt lift towards the end of that string. I’ll probably drop to 41.1 grs and call it good. I’m not getting the velocity that Clay has on the WTO website for that barrel length/ load combo without a little pressure. Clay mentioned to me that some PROOF barrels trend a bit slow.
Animals won’t know the difference and it shoots really well in Virgin Alpha brass. I’m hoping pressure will be lower in once fired brass.
As for your cratering, if you’re not getting heavy bolt lift or extractor swipe on case head you’re PROBABLY good. I’m pressure averse though, see it cause problems too often in real conditions.
Seems like CCI 450’s crater on me fairly often in different calibers, even with mild loads. Maybe it’s my action too, running Terminus Zeus and Apollo lite.
The Hornady die has been working fine. It’s shooting the cartridge with small rifle primers is the factor I’ve changed.@fmillik, I have not used my Hornady 7 saw die yet but that does seem odd. I’m assuming you used case lube?
I have a 22” PROOF carbon I’m shooting suppressed. Saw II chamber.
41.2 grs of Varget yielded me:
Avg 2686 FPS ES of 7 , SD of 2.8. (7 shots) with the 162 ELD-M, hope that helps. COAL of 2.899 seemed good, it liked that seating depth.
I was still getting a bit of cratering and slightly heavy bolt lift towards the end of that string. I’ll probably drop to 41.1 grs and call it good. I’m not getting the velocity that Clay has on the WTO website for that barrel length/ load combo without a little pressure. Clay mentioned to me that some PROOF barrels trend a bit slow.
Animals won’t know the difference and it shoots really well in Virgin Alpha brass. I’m hoping pressure will be lower in once fired brass.
As for your cratering, if you’re not getting heavy bolt lift or extractor swipe on case head you’re PROBABLY good. I’m pressure averse though, see it cause problems too often in real conditions.
Seems like CCI 450’s crater on me fairly often in different calibers, even with mild loads. Maybe it’s my action too, running Terminus Zeus and Apollo lite.
View attachment 8112482View attachment 8112483
I’m going to test some more this afternoon at 41.7 grs. I think without other indications of issues or more extreme evidence of over-pressure it should be fine.
Welp, pierced the primer at 41.7 grs of Varget and a 162 gr eldx. No visible damage to firing pin or boltface.
Strangely my rifle seems to have had less pressure indications using my converted Alpha 7-08 brass and LRPs, as I’ve had both the 162 sst and 162 eldx moving 2600+ FPS in that setup.
Strangely my rifle seems to have had less pressure indications using my converted Alpha 7-08 brass and LRPs, as I’ve had both the 162 sst and 162 eldx moving 2600+ FPS in that setup.
Does “virgin” brass tend to be a little more pressure sensitive than brass that has been reloaded?@fmillik, I have not used my Hornady 7 saw die yet but that does seem odd. I’m assuming you used case lube?
I have a 22” PROOF carbon I’m shooting suppressed. Saw II chamber.
41.2 grs of Varget yielded me:
Avg 2686 FPS ES of 7 , SD of 2.8. (7 shots) with the 162 ELD-M, hope that helps. COAL of 2.899 seemed good, it liked that seating depth.
I was still getting a bit of cratering and slightly heavy bolt lift towards the end of that string. I’ll probably drop to 41.1 grs and call it good. I’m not getting the velocity that Clay has on the WTO website for that barrel length/ load combo without a little pressure. Clay mentioned to me that some PROOF barrels trend a bit slow.
Animals won’t know the difference and it shoots really well in Virgin Alpha brass. I’m hoping pressure will be lower in once fired brass.
As for your cratering, if you’re not getting heavy bolt lift or extractor swipe on case head you’re PROBABLY good. I’m pressure averse though, see it cause problems too often in real conditions.
Seems like CCI 450’s crater on me fairly often in different calibers, even with mild loads. Maybe it’s my action too, running Terminus Zeus and Apollo lite.
View attachment 8112482View attachment 8112483
I’ve been reloading for about 6 years, but this is the first time I’ve done extensive testing with multiple bullets/powders/primers.
I kept messing around with the SRP & ended up giving up on getting them to work.
I tried loading a grain below max for 7mm-08 with 160 gr projectiles and H4350. Still too much cratering.
Then last weekend, I noticed that my firing pin protruded beyond what is recommended (.063), so I sanded it down to .055. Shot a few. Still overly-cratered. Sanded some more to .050. Still cratered. Went down to .045 and was still getting too much cratering. Gave up.
Ultimately, shooting 160 gr bullets at 2600 FPS is more than I was expecting from a 18.5" barrel, so I'm going to leave well-enough alone and stick with my Alpha LRP brass that I converted from 7mm-08..
I tried loading a grain below max for 7mm-08 with 160 gr projectiles and H4350. Still too much cratering.
Then last weekend, I noticed that my firing pin protruded beyond what is recommended (.063), so I sanded it down to .055. Shot a few. Still overly-cratered. Sanded some more to .050. Still cratered. Went down to .045 and was still getting too much cratering. Gave up.
Ultimately, shooting 160 gr bullets at 2600 FPS is more than I was expecting from a 18.5" barrel, so I'm going to leave well-enough alone and stick with my Alpha LRP brass that I converted from 7mm-08..
Is anyone else having issues with their 7 SAW just being horribly slow? This is my ladder test with 168 Berger VLDs, WTO alpha brass, H4350 and Br4 primers. I have a 26” barrel and I feel like this is entirely too slow for what it should be. With 43.3 grains of h4350 I was averaging 2600 with my 180 grain Berger hybrids. I also get weird pressure issues when I get close to 44 grains of H4350.
As an update to my previous post. I found out why I was having velocity and pressure issues. I had a nice carbon ring problem. After cleaning it out, I was averaging 2760 with 168 Bergers with 45 grains of H4350.
Here’s some data with N550 and the 162 eldm. 26” barrel, alpha brass, BR4s. Had a couple of errors on my chrono I’ve never had before.
Has anyone shot the 140ish class of bullets yet? I’m looking at getting one spun up. Is 2950ish too much of an ask out of a 22in?
I was looking at a 22in Bartlein Carbon. Hoping for 2900-3K with the 139/145 LRX or 139CX WITH a temp stable powder. Those bullets Gives me almost 2100 FPS and 1400 FT Lbs at 550 yards. I just have a hard on for monos for hunting.
Gotcha.
I don’t think you would have trouble getting to 2950 using a Bartlein w/ an appropriate twist, but I’m not the person to ask - I don’t shoot the 7SAW yet. I’ve been on the fence watching this thread for 6 months, but have decided to make the jump at the end of summer w/ a build for NRL Hunter
I don’t think you would have trouble getting to 2950 using a Bartlein w/ an appropriate twist, but I’m not the person to ask - I don’t shoot the 7SAW yet. I’ve been on the fence watching this thread for 6 months, but have decided to make the jump at the end of summer w/ a build for NRL Hunter
Did you ever get a chance to run the 180s higher? What was your powder charge and velocity?
Got out to start shooting the rifle finally today. I have enough IMR 4166 to burn out the barrel, so I'm hoping I can get a good load with it. I started out with finding max load for 4166 paired with BR4, and federal 205M primers.
Working my way up from 39.0 to 44.5 gr in 0.5 gr increments. 44.5 was compressed so that was as far as the case would allow. 168gr berger vld Seated at 2.950 coal.
Max velocity I made it to once I saw slight pressure signs on the case head was 2798 fps with BR4 primers and 2795 fps with the 205M primers, both at 42.0 gr. Max velocity i made it to with worsening, but not extreme, pressure signs was 2952 fps at 44.5 grs. I only went that high with the CCI primers, as speeds were damn near identical between the 2 types of primers. 41.5 gave me 2776 and 2775 for BR4 and 205M primers respectively.
I'm pretty happy with these speeds as I was hoping to use up the 4166 since it's discontinued. I will do the same thing with IMR 4451 as I have 8lbs of that too and would like to find a use for it, and have more brass to get some firings on before I really start playing with the load. On WTO website it states that the avg velocities for 168gr bullets are right where I'm at if I play between 41.5-42.0 grs, so I'm pretty happy so far with the results.
I feel like CCI primers are preferred so far, judging on target. All shots between 39.0 and 42.0 grouped together, the next 3 after found a new POI.
The 205M primers were a little more scattered.
Working my way up from 39.0 to 44.5 gr in 0.5 gr increments. 44.5 was compressed so that was as far as the case would allow. 168gr berger vld Seated at 2.950 coal.
Max velocity I made it to once I saw slight pressure signs on the case head was 2798 fps with BR4 primers and 2795 fps with the 205M primers, both at 42.0 gr. Max velocity i made it to with worsening, but not extreme, pressure signs was 2952 fps at 44.5 grs. I only went that high with the CCI primers, as speeds were damn near identical between the 2 types of primers. 41.5 gave me 2776 and 2775 for BR4 and 205M primers respectively.
I'm pretty happy with these speeds as I was hoping to use up the 4166 since it's discontinued. I will do the same thing with IMR 4451 as I have 8lbs of that too and would like to find a use for it, and have more brass to get some firings on before I really start playing with the load. On WTO website it states that the avg velocities for 168gr bullets are right where I'm at if I play between 41.5-42.0 grs, so I'm pretty happy so far with the results.
I feel like CCI primers are preferred so far, judging on target. All shots between 39.0 and 42.0 grouped together, the next 3 after found a new POI.
The 205M primers were a little more scattered.
I’m also using IMR 4166 with pretty good results with limited testing. Looks like my velocity is in line with yours since I am running a 22” barrel.
162 Nat. Match AMax - WTO Alpha Brass - CCI 450 - IMR4166 - 2.945 COAL
40= 2657
40.5= 2677
41= 2717
41.5= 2741
42= 2775
I got some chipping from the ejector on all the charge weights so I’m thinking that may have just been from excess headspace on virgin brass? All primers looked good with no cratering.
Im also working on a load for IMR 4451. I only have 1 lb so I was going to use that only for some low volume hunting rounds. With a 162 BTSP Hornady I got 2665 with 43.5 and 2887 with 44 gr. Let me know how the 4451 works out for you. I’m hoping to find something in that range that matches POI with my other loads so I don’t have to rezero to switch over for a hunt.
162 Nat. Match AMax - WTO Alpha Brass - CCI 450 - IMR4166 - 2.945 COAL
40= 2657
40.5= 2677
41= 2717
41.5= 2741
42= 2775
I got some chipping from the ejector on all the charge weights so I’m thinking that may have just been from excess headspace on virgin brass? All primers looked good with no cratering.
Im also working on a load for IMR 4451. I only have 1 lb so I was going to use that only for some low volume hunting rounds. With a 162 BTSP Hornady I got 2665 with 43.5 and 2887 with 44 gr. Let me know how the 4451 works out for you. I’m hoping to find something in that range that matches POI with my other loads so I don’t have to rezero to switch over for a hunt.
Well IMR 4451 was a bust. Barely made it to 2600 fps at 43.5 gr. There was a little bit of crunching when seating the bullet at that charge, so I figured that should be as far as I try. No pressure signs either. 4166 seems like a good choice, glad I have so much of it.
