Have one of the new mausingfield in hand. Formulating an opinion on it.
It’s definitely over engineered, in a good way.
It’s definitely over engineered, in a good way.
-
Having trouble using the site?
Contact support
American Rifle Company New Archimedes Action, New Xylo Chassis, and major Mausingfield revision
- Thread starter karagias
- Start date
So.....ok ......this is why folks gets pissed. Archimedes- June....nope.....maybe July.....
Ooops.....No.......maybe August.......oooops......sooooon.......sorrrry......sooooon.....WTF!!!!
Ooops.....No.......maybe August.......oooops......sooooon.......sorrrry......sooooon.....WTF!!!!
I called them again today. They said "end of August". I'm probably going to buy something else.
lol did people not learn with the Nucleus...
"Fool me once, shame on you... fool me twice, shame on me"
-someone, at some point after falling for the same trick two pre-orders in a row
"Fool me once, shame on you... fool me twice, shame on me"
-someone, at some point after falling for the same trick two pre-orders in a row
I guess I'm part of the silent majority that's waiting (more or less) patiently for the Archimedes release. Would I like to have had it in May, as originally stated? Sure. However, I am familiar enough with the challenges faced by small businesses when releasing a new/innovative product that I tend to take delays in stride. All it takes is one supplier (or supplier's supplier) to experience a shortage of a critical component or material to throw a wrench in the whole works.
While we can all sit on the sidelines and talk about how a business should ALWAYS multi-source critical components, etc..., the long and short of it is that for small businesses, any time spent locating and qualifying a secondary supplier is time NOT spent performing your own added value processes to the parts that you do have. Further, it's VERY easy for small businesses to get into an inventory-rich/cash-poor situation; if a given supplier has a minimum order of, say, $100k (a number I just pulled out of my ass), a small business owner may be (understandably) hesitant to make that commitment given that HIS creditors don't accept rifle action parts as a valid form of payment (read: he needs to be able to maintain a degree of liquidity).
I'm NOT saying that any of the above applies to ARC; maybe it does, maybe it doesn't. I don't know any more about the situation than any of you do... I'm just saying that small businesses offering innovative (read: unique/bespoke) products face a number of challenges that may not be apparent from the outside.
While we can all sit on the sidelines and talk about how a business should ALWAYS multi-source critical components, etc..., the long and short of it is that for small businesses, any time spent locating and qualifying a secondary supplier is time NOT spent performing your own added value processes to the parts that you do have. Further, it's VERY easy for small businesses to get into an inventory-rich/cash-poor situation; if a given supplier has a minimum order of, say, $100k (a number I just pulled out of my ass), a small business owner may be (understandably) hesitant to make that commitment given that HIS creditors don't accept rifle action parts as a valid form of payment (read: he needs to be able to maintain a degree of liquidity).
I'm NOT saying that any of the above applies to ARC; maybe it does, maybe it doesn't. I don't know any more about the situation than any of you do... I'm just saying that small businesses offering innovative (read: unique/bespoke) products face a number of challenges that may not be apparent from the outside.
You seem to be a reasonable person.
I work making high end fly fishing tackle.
Hand made in USA stuff.
We find lots of issues getting new products out.
Quirky boss/designer.
Material issues.
Material procurement
Research and development.
Labor issues.
Tooling and layup design and procedures.
Often you’ll find an issue or a point of improvement when initiating production and you really can’t just ignore it and press on.
Really big companies have people well trained with lots of experience to manage such projects and even they have difficulty’s.
Little company’s often just try to plow forward and adjust/modify/adapt as needed.
^^^ exactly ^^^
Thats why they made saturdays and sundays
His large back order speaks to his dedicated customer base but waiting 6 mth (with no end in sight) for a product which is not "ground breaking", is just to much for me.
you can always come back and order one when the bugs are worked out and its delivering
but waiting that long for a build...im to impatient
I knew there would be delays. I'm working on project and need an action sooner rather than later. It's not the end of the world. I'm going to let the order stand and just hold on to the action for another project.
Don't get me wrong; I have no problem with small, indenpend
Don't get me wrong; I completely understand the difficulties that are present with a small, independently owned business, and I have no qualms with ARC or anything of the sort.
My particular statement was more directed towards those who have already begun posting their "I've been waiting for XX years/months/days" sob stories.
Don't get me wrong; I completely understand the difficulties that are present with a small, independently owned business, and I have no qualms with ARC or anything of the sort.
My particular statement was more directed towards those who have already begun posting their "I've been waiting for XX years/months/days" sob stories.
If you paid for a pre-order from ARC or any other company for something that you NEED for a build by a certain time you are doing it wrong. Also, do you really NEED any of this? Haha. I'm willing to bet these things are little more than toys for 99.9% of us. Chill out, move on if you are tired of waiting. You people bitching must not have any NFA items. Welcome to a whole new world of waiting.
see with NFA...there is no ETA, expected ship dates, nothing
people buy stuff expecting it, and then add 4 months, or a year in some cases. that's a little excessive.
the last action i ordered didn't hit the deadline (missed by 1 week), but i was informed way ahead of time of the delay and given a new date. that's how it should be done.
now you know my secrete to business.
tool up and schedule to capacity
then
under promise and over perform
as long as your in the market lead time, you a hero and your costs are managed
tool up and schedule to capacity
then
under promise and over perform
as long as your in the market lead time, you a hero and your costs are managed
The lesson to be learned this year is to do more market research and probably only release one new action at a time.
The only reason why the Archimedes was delayed is that people threw a fit about the Mausingfield they introduced at SHOT.
Quite honestly it was easy to see that coming. When you go from integral lug to separate on a $1,600 action and also to a Nucleus style rail and nitride finish which is seen as a downgrade but the price stays the same, some people will bitch instead of just order something else.
What I didn't predict was both actions getting redesigned.
I'm not complaining because the Archimedes got a pretty big upgrade in the deal, I am not in a hurry and even if I had an action, I still would be figuring out a barrel for it.
I got a Nucleus pre-order action last year, wasn't counting on it to be on time.
I was hoping for July/August when I ordered my Archimedes. The fact that it doesn't seem far off after two redesigns is pretty good.
The only bummer for everyone involved is that a lot of the delay was probably preventable.
The only reason why the Archimedes was delayed is that people threw a fit about the Mausingfield they introduced at SHOT.
Quite honestly it was easy to see that coming. When you go from integral lug to separate on a $1,600 action and also to a Nucleus style rail and nitride finish which is seen as a downgrade but the price stays the same, some people will bitch instead of just order something else.
What I didn't predict was both actions getting redesigned.
I'm not complaining because the Archimedes got a pretty big upgrade in the deal, I am not in a hurry and even if I had an action, I still would be figuring out a barrel for it.
I got a Nucleus pre-order action last year, wasn't counting on it to be on time.
I was hoping for July/August when I ordered my Archimedes. The fact that it doesn't seem far off after two redesigns is pretty good.
The only bummer for everyone involved is that a lot of the delay was probably preventable.
I ordered a TL3 and it came in a week. I still have an Archimedes on order but it isn't going to be used for the build I had originally planned. I knew it would be late and don't mind the delays but ARC started the infamous "two more weeks" line and that usually means bad things.
Archimedes bolt actions should begin shipping in 1-2 weeks. All parts are in the final coating process with the exception of long left receivers and subsequent batches of receivers. We expect it to take a few weeks to finish shipping outstanding orders.
You will receive your final invoice by email. In preparation for processing your order, please have an FFL selected to receive your action. FFL contact information and a copy of the license will be requested by email when you receive your final invoice.
Thank you very much for your patience and business.
American Rifle Company
[email protected]
You will receive your final invoice by email. In preparation for processing your order, please have an FFL selected to receive your action. FFL contact information and a copy of the license will be requested by email when you receive your final invoice.
Thank you very much for your patience and business.
American Rifle Company
[email protected]
You are assuming 1-2 weeks doesn’t extend to Christmas. This is the firearms industry we’re talking about.
Very true. If it does show up when they say cool. If not it's no big deal.
Yeah, I’m definitely excited about this and the new chassis, but I also pre-ordered without expecting any kind of specific timeline. It is what it is.
We will see when they ask for FFL info and final payment. If they expect to start shipping in 1-2 weeks those ducks need to be in a row very soon for things to be smooth.
thanks for the update, from the horses mouth as well!!!
Do you guys know about how many are on the way or regular batch size +\- ?
Don’t know how long the list is, but would give a gut call for future plans...at least for me.
Do you guys know about how many are on the way or regular batch size +\- ?
Don’t know how long the list is, but would give a gut call for future plans...at least for me.
I'm going to believe ARC when they say the parts are all finished and only require coating.
That might leave the laser engraving as the last step. Then it's going to take some time to assemble, box and ship (matching FFL to order info to shipping info and billing info).
I'm not expecting to be in the first batch but I got the same email yesterday so maybe. Best case, I think it will hit my FFL in three weeks, then I begin the stupid 10 day wait which is really more like two weeks.
That might leave the laser engraving as the last step. Then it's going to take some time to assemble, box and ship (matching FFL to order info to shipping info and billing info).
I'm not expecting to be in the first batch but I got the same email yesterday so maybe. Best case, I think it will hit my FFL in three weeks, then I begin the stupid 10 day wait which is really more like two weeks.
The last day before they extended the pre-order. I got the email so maybe check your spam folder.
I got the email and I'm order 1002X for a right hand .380 bolt face. I'm pretty excited to get it and swap the bolt head from my Nucleus and use the Archimedes for 6x47 and the Nuleus for 223. Figure the larger cartridge would probably benefit a bit more from the additional extraction capability. Kind of sweet that the bolt heads are interchangeable. I'm also looking forward to getting the chassis as well. My guess is Ted has done some tinkering with the final design before they committed to manufacturing. Overall, I'm pretty happy with the timeline and the upgrades that were built into the action. Can't wait to see it.
I know he was tinkering with the stock adjustments to make adjustment positions closer together.
The Xylo certainly seems interesting. Now that JAE is no longer a product on the market, I'll have to look to alternatives in the future for new chassis'. The Xylo seems to be the most interesting out the current crop of chassis'.
The grip seems pretty large, which is a downside to someone like me with small hands. I understand that Ted is going to open source the dimensions of the chassis where the grips fit, so that the consumer can source their own grips (awesome if you can do it yourself or know someone you trust to do it for you). I wish that the grip was made of micarta, with two two different thicknesses, one to accommodate smaller hands. The profile of the grip itself seems pretty nice though.
Another small tweak I would like to see done is to attach a bag rider to the bottom of the adjustable butt pad/plate.
The grip seems pretty large, which is a downside to someone like me with small hands. I understand that Ted is going to open source the dimensions of the chassis where the grips fit, so that the consumer can source their own grips (awesome if you can do it yourself or know someone you trust to do it for you). I wish that the grip was made of micarta, with two two different thicknesses, one to accommodate smaller hands. The profile of the grip itself seems pretty nice though.
Another small tweak I would like to see done is to attach a bag rider to the bottom of the adjustable butt pad/plate.
Note that the grip is a block of walnut and you can and should file and sand it down until you like it, then re-finish it.
You could also sand the grip down to fit your hands. That's a good benefit to the grip being wood. Shouldn't be too hard with a few pieces of sandpaper.
One certainly could if they were so inclined.
I just feel like micarta would be a better solution. More weather resistant (wood expands and contracts, and can crack in temperature extremes), and has more of a "grippy" texture to it which would be a bonus when shooting in the rain. I imagine the wood will have the potential to be slippery.
But that's just me. Overall, I think the Xylo is going to be a neat chassis.
I have fairly big palms with slightly stubby fingers, I usually have to wear XL gloves and usually the fingertips are a bit long while the fit is tight in the palm.
I'm planning to make a small set of grip blanks and then use Sugru to mold it to my hand and use that as a model to carve walnut grips slightly large and then finish them with rasps and sandpaper to get my perfect fit.
I could also get the molded grips laser scanned and have a set of grips 3D printed or CNC machined.
The Xylo is made for that. For people who don't want to settle for a one size fits all grip.
Maybe you would be happier with an MPA?
I'm planning to make a small set of grip blanks and then use Sugru to mold it to my hand and use that as a model to carve walnut grips slightly large and then finish them with rasps and sandpaper to get my perfect fit.
I could also get the molded grips laser scanned and have a set of grips 3D printed or CNC machined.
The Xylo is made for that. For people who don't want to settle for a one size fits all grip.
Maybe you would be happier with an MPA?
If I end up being really interested in the Xylo, I would probably just get a set of micarta grips made for it.
Not a fan of MPA. JAE is my chassis of choice.
I know micarta is nice, I have several knife handles and 1911 grips made from it but those are quite different use cases. You're not going to chop wood with a bolt action rifle or shoot one handed.
I have a sheet of 3/4" red micarta that I salvaged from some electrical equipment and I could use it to make Xylo grips with the same woodworking tools but why?
Walnut is beautiful, traditional and you could stipple or checker it if you need more grip than a smooth finish.
I have a sheet of 3/4" red micarta that I salvaged from some electrical equipment and I could use it to make Xylo grips with the same woodworking tools but why?
Walnut is beautiful, traditional and you could stipple or checker it if you need more grip than a smooth finish.
Wood warp from heat/humidity for a barrel channel or an action inlet without pillars, sure. For grips, mehh... Don't think it matters.
Similar threads
