British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

I dont doubt that the Brit made a great shot, But I cant wrap my head around what they are describing. The math doesnt lie. just dont see it being impossible... Unless... It was really Bear Grylls. Then I could believe it.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

Had to be using one of those new "CounterSniper scope/rifle packages" purchased with stimulus money. I am jealous
cry.gif
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

I think the simple solution to this is the media fucked up. That's not uncommon. I remember an incident our platoon was involved in and I remember reading about it later. We all joked at the different storied and how distorted they were. Even though they had a few of the facts, they had shit written in their article that was completely made up on their part. I think there is a simple explanation, but we will never know until the man who made the shot or someone who was there comes out and tells us. I would not be surprised at all if the author threw in some falsifiable information just to complete their work. This shit happens all the time.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

There seems to be a lot of propaganda stuff on this info but technically it is possible. Accuracy would however have to phenomenal. Hitting the PKM intentionally is definitely BS + seeing the where did the man get a hit.

How this could be made

1. With P4 reticle. The rifle is sighted to 1000m or further distance to the highest point of reticle. This would give 26mils from the elevation turrets, 5mils from the upper bar to cross hairs, after cross hairs 27,5mils at power 5.Total elevation 58,5mils.(5+27,5+26=58.5) The amount of elevation available under cross hairs is depended of the power used. If the rifle is sighted to 1000m at the height of 1000m above sea level and shots taken are at the same level, only 47.9 mils of elevation is needed to shoot up to 2500m. If the rifle is sighted with the given technique to even further distance, higher power could be used on scope.

2. Previous shots have been taken from the same place and to same range. This would make the hits much more possible.

3. QTU or JBM has been used.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

The shot was verified on the ground using appropriate equipment and by others involved in the contact. MOD have displayed very poor PERSEC in releasing the reports; not for the first time either.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

I just find it to hard to believe... Anyone with ELR experience knows that even a real good shot in a perfect world to get one kill at that range is A LOT of luck. Now a 2nd shot really raises my left eye brow.

 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record


As in all things , some truth , & some spin .

However I find it funny , no one ever Questioned the Canadian snipers record 50 bmg shot , yet all are out to say this is BS .

I think the 50bmg was a McMillan Tac50 Canadian model with 16x M1 MK4 , I wonder how much of his reticle he used to make his shot ?

Any way RE the 3 shots & 3 hits , 2x men 1x weapon , I think thats a little bit of spin .

My take would be he fired 3 shots at 2 tgts , ie 1 shot missed .

Later Chris
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

Rob Furlong admited to connect on the <span style="font-weight: bold">third</span> shot, and the 50 BMG (750 A-Max) was still in the supersonic range... lots of luck (and skill of course) involved but credible. The leupold Mk4 16X has lots of elevation available, even with a close range zero. And the rifle is still on display to check anything.

Now this is at longer range with a 338 LM, 250 Lock Base, waaay past transonic range (we know the lapuas make the transition well, though), <span style="font-weight: bold">hitting on the FIRST shot, then another, and then yet another on a MG (less than 0.25 MOA target)!!!</span> What are the odds? And with the driver as a spotter!

The brits normally have a 29 MOA base and 5-25X scope with P4F reticle, and as others have explained above the power should zoom down to 8X (or perhaps 12X at high altitude) to get the neccesary come ups.

Quite different, and IMO strechs the limits of credibility.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

Reminds me of an episode of The Unit where they shot a couple guys in the back of a hum vee using a 50 then shot the mg ammo can and the radiator of the hv.
Actually this explains the whole deal, the author was watching reruns of the unit and thought it was real.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

I find it ironically funny that a majority of the people posting here that it BS honestly have no clue as to ballistics and/or the ELR shooting knowledge. NOT saying all as I know a few that have posted doubts are well beyond capable in regards to ballistics and knowledge.

What is funny is that everyone jumps on and says "if it was 50 I could see it"..for ease of discussion and lamens terms...the 338LM with 250gr scenars and the 50BMG with 750Amax are damn close in regards to transonic distance...especially at 8K ASL.

I learned a long time ago to research ALL the details before saying YES or BS as I remember people back in early 2000 claimed BS right off that bat when it was put publicly about the 408 doing over 2K..now look at people today.

Here is another link to story...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...ish-patrol.html
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

Later,

The posted link appears to be recounting a different incedent.


I guess I would ask you the question. Do you as a ELR shooter raise your eyebrows at all on 3 first round hits with a .338 LM at that distance?
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Chiller</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Later,

The posted link appears to be recounting a different incedent.

</div></div>

Chiller--thats why I said people should research ALL the details..Seems all the media is reporting different accounts at different media release dates. It appears to be different incident but yet this incident only appears when speaking and searching for the "other" incident. I posted that link to show the skillset and mindset of the British Troops (Sorry wasn't meant to post saying same incident entirely).

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Chiller</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Later,

I guess I would ask you the question. Do you as a ELR shooter raise your eyebrows at all on 3 first round hits with a .338 LM at that distance?
</div></div>

Raises eyebrows?? ABSOLUTELY!!! But for people to chime in and automatically say BS could end with them eating crow
smile.gif


But run the numbers on 250gr doing 2970 at 8K ASL and you will see that it is not that "far" beyond transonic yet when people say they shooting 308 at 1500yd nobody really questions even though when comparing the 2 situations the "beyond" transonic distance is comparable. Seems no one has pulled down the environmental data for the region he was in that day to even begin to review that side of it.

Thanks
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Savage110</div><div class="ubbcode-body">im calling bull shit on this whole thing, shooting a fuckin machine gun at 2700yds (first round hit my ass) </div></div>
I'm having a hard time believing it as well but if it's true good on him.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

That my friend is Old school Long Range.
A Sharps rifle in 45-90, 45-120 or maybe a 50-90.
Used back in the days for Bison.
Also featured in the movie Quickley down under with Tom Seleck, the operator has the same beard as Tom Seleck in the movie.
What a cool picture.

Here you go:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRKUMUPcR7k&feature=related

And long range 1100m with a sharps:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_xGARJZo...=1&index=14

English version, a bit shorter:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YRaRCCZjdTM&feature=related


Cheers,

Master Diver
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

Few would believe that a .223 can do a mile, but its been done:
http://www.longrangehunting.com/articles/shooting-223-mile-1.php
The little AMAX passed to subsonic smoothly. Why wouldn't the .338?

The 250 gr. bullet is still traveling at around 800 fps according to JBM. That's more than enough energy to kill. If the shots were first round hits, there was some luck involved there and its an embellishment to try and make it out to be purely skill.

I think Furlong's account was more credible because he admitted that it took three shots and a bit of luck to do it. He also didn't want the publicity. He wasn't seeking it, and for good reason; the reaction of the CF brass and Canadian government at the time was not that of celebration. Rumor is that other CF snipers beat his record but kept there mouths shut to avoid being Furlong'd.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Later</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Chiller</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Later,

The posted link appears to be recounting a different incedent.

</div></div>

Chiller--thats why I said people should research ALL the details..Seems all the media is reporting different accounts at different media release dates. It appears to be different incident but yet this incident only appears when speaking and searching for the "other" incident. I posted that link to show the skillset and mindset of the British Troops (Sorry wasn't meant to post saying same incident entirely).

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Chiller</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Later,

I guess I would ask you the question. Do you as a ELR shooter raise your eyebrows at all on 3 first round hits with a .338 LM at that distance?
</div></div>

Raises eyebrows?? ABSOLUTELY!!! But for people to chime in and automatically say BS could end with them eating crow
smile.gif


But run the numbers on 250gr doing 2970 at 8K ASL and you will see that it is not that "far" beyond transonic yet when people say they shooting 308 at 1500yd nobody really questions even though when comparing the 2 situations the "beyond" transonic distance is comparable. Seems no one has pulled down the environmental data for the region he was in that day to even begin to review that side of it.

Thanks </div></div>

There has been quite a few story's in our Press about success of British snipers and I think there are a few reasons for this.

1) Our snipers are good. Actually, they are excellent. In fact, generally across the board, the standard of British soldiers at the moment is at an all time high. Regiments like The Rifles or my former unit, The Royal Welch, are going over to Afghanistan and are just excelling.

2) Large sections of the British Press love to be super patriotic when it comes to the troops even if they are often critical of the politics of the war. Tabliods like the Sun really do go overboard supporting our troops and I know its great appreciated. Sometimes this "enthusiasm" leads to accounts being "talked up"

3) We've taken a fair number of casualties over the last few months from Taliban "sharpshooters". Whether its one guy or more is not being publically acknowledged, but "somebody" is capable of putting down effective fire out to 400, 500 and 600m, way beyond what the average Taliban is capable of.

As this is being reported in the Press, I suspect the MOD is releasing a flurry of British sniper stories as part of the counter "propaganda war"....I see nothing wrong with that, as long as we recognise it for what it is..


 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

Check out the picture in the second artical. it has a how long does it take to travel chart on it. The first article may have taken the distance off of that. Unless thats just a ridiulous coincidence.

1st article claims 1.54 miles
2nd article states that the bullet takes 2.64 seconds to get there.

the second article probably picked that out of some obscure balistics book. and the first one read the article and said wow a guy shot 1.54 miles.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

I have shot my 22-250 at 2000 yards.Some would say that is not possible. The world record prairie dog hit is at 3125 yards with a 338 shooting a 300 gr SMK. The big difference is these had custom bases for "extreme" distance. I don't doubt those cartridges will reach that far-I don't know if you can do it with that scope and base and get that distance dialed in.Does anyone have the same set up and can verify it's possibility.It looks like it would take around 169 minutes or so. I originally thought it would take around 190 minutes.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

Jimmy, what do you hit with your 22-250 at 2000 yds, and how often? What is the average spread of your load at this distance, in MOA?

That world record for a prairie dog hit was not only with a very special base, but probably after maany rangings shots, maany days trying, and on an exceptionally lucky day that
smile.gif


Everything is possible, but hitting the jackpot three times in a row is higly unlikely, to say the least. Perhaps Pete E is right.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

TiroFijo I set up a 55 gallon drum and after a few "sighter" shots was on target. I hit it 5 times in a row and the bullet(80 grain serrias) went thru the front and stuck in the back and 2 fell in the bottom after hitting the back.It was a pretty still day.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

Just throwing this out there (not saying if I believe it or not)-

Anyone here ever do high angle fire? Might be your answer---
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

Angle 'might' play albeit only slightly.

With 2700 yards being the hypotenuse what do you want to assume your angle to be?
15 degree 2600 yard horizontal
25 degree 2450 yard horizontal
45 degree 1900 yard horizontal (did I also mention that would be 1900 vertical)

 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

whistle.gif


Not trying to be rude to anyone saying this; but I think there is a REAL BIG POINT being missed in here... Yes for someone to hit someone at 1.54 miles or 2,704 meters is possible but with a lot of luck even from one of your best shooters. People are trying to do the math to make logic of the improbable.

The poing being; I find it EXTREMELY hard to believe that these "SHOTS" yes shots ALL scored. Anyone with a brain cell knows that the simplest minute miscalculation at that range is going to throw your shot off left, right, high or low enough to miss or a slight wind change during all of this.

<span style="font-size: 11pt"><span style="font-weight: bold">The bottom line is this</span></span>. All he needed was a witness to say that it happened and than truth or not becomes record.

Not saying it didn't happen. But it's however very, very unlikely and until someone presents and provides people with the moral value of this shooter; I will find it distasteful to listen to.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

In my opinion,and I don't know that this has been hit on before, is that it is all propaganda. Not saying that he did not make the shot but like most everyone I think that some of the story has been embellished simply for psychological reasons.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

250gr lapua scener @3000fps, 95 degrees F, 29.92InHG, 100yd zero

2700m, 0 degrees, 8mph L-R wind:
152.1 MOA elevation
19.3 MOA Left Windage
893fps
443fpe
5.678sec time in flight

2700m, 30 degrees, 8mph L-R wind:
124.5 MOA Elevation
18.5 MOA Left Windage
929fps
479fpe
5.557sec time in flight


There are the numbers if anyone cares to add that into their determination if it's possible or not (again, not making a judgement on it)
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: benchduck</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One shot luck.


THREE SHOTS B.S. </div></div>

Roger that!
Here is a link to the British Sniper School just to show that there is nothing special about their training in comparison to any other school you might have to go to.

One shot @ TWO THOUSAND SEVEN HUNDRED FOUR meters raises eye brow.

Two shots @ TWO THOUSAND SEVEN HUNDRED FOUR meters; bs...

Three shots @ TWO THOUSAND SEVEN HUNDRED FOUR mters; alot of bs...
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lonewolf&#8207;</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: benchduck</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One shot luck.


THREE SHOTS B.S. </div></div>

Roger that!
Here is a link to the British Sniper School just to show that there is nothing special about their training in comparison to any other school you might have to go to.

One shot @ TWO THOUSAND SEVEN HUNDRED FOUR meters raises eye brow.

Two shots @ TWO THOUSAND SEVEN HUNDRED FOUR meters; bs...

Three shots @ TWO THOUSAND SEVEN HUNDRED FOUR mters; alot of bs...


</div></div>

That my friend is not strictly true. The bumf laid out in that link is the basic 'minimum' required to be badged. Individual units take great pride in pushing their potential sniper teams a lot further than the minimum.

My own unit left us after a stalk into position for two days with no warning and no prior prep for an extended stay in -12 degrees centigrade. That was not unusual. After completing the badge test, we had to stalk to within 100 to 130m of red deer and kill at least three. No kill, no badge. One individual failed because he stalked successful within 20m of the OP on badge test and then stalked away without being observed. His stalking and tracking were the best I have ever seen other than Kalahari bushmen, yet he still failed the cadre.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: benchduck</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I shoot a lot of the long stuff.We have a place to shoot 2661yds and i am telling you this story is BULL SHIT
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...874#Post1739874</div></div>


LMAO..and this is coming from the guy that posted this thread..... http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showgallery&Number=1785403&page=1

AND inspired this thread...
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showgallery&Number=1786371#comments

Just as your friend in that first thread attempted to call out 9H..you probably shouldn't attempt to call anyone out either..but hey thats just me thinking.

Thanks
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

I posted pics for sombody and was flamed for my punctuation and spelling.I was trying to post from my phone which makes punctuation difficult.I guess no credibility for me over punctuation?? I keep posting pics of people shooting out to 2660yd.I do that with photo shop you see.I bribe me a bunch of witnesses to say we shoot the long stuff and there.Man you got me figured out. Do you think it really did happen 3 shots 3 hits at 2706 the last one to intentionally disable a machine gun yes or no?

Could you do it?
Do you know someone who could?
I asked this to one of the top tier usmc snipers instructors he laughed and said nope not three in a row.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

You know, after I posted the first time I realized something. I watched "Mac" from "Future Weapons" shoot two different systems @ 2500 yds and hit steel three times in three consecutive shots each. That was with the 408 Cheytac and the 416 Barrett. Granted, they stated that the rifles were zeroed for that range and confirmed before they shot it on film. But, the three shots were consecutively fired. The one group with the 408 Cheytac, if I remember right, was only about 14"(?).

I know that was made for a documentary. But in reality, those are real weapons systems. The AI rifles are every bit as good. Given perfect conditions I firmly believe the two taliban could have been hit consecutively. The part about the machine-gun was either pure luck or someone didn't count rounds in between that and the two body hits. But I know that either way it ends up being luck with a target that small at that range.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkKL4_ljNYk&feature=player_embedded

High altitude, low altitude, even if the round does or does not have enough energy at that distance does not matter...it will be BS either way.

Even if you bring the range back to 1 mile = 1600m, it will be near impossible to get those kind of numbers; 3 shots 3 hits without sighters, and the third one on a machinegun, laying down on the ground. Those who shoot a lot with a AWM 338lm know the limits of the setup...the 250scenar, the max elevation of 96 moa of the S&B PMII 5-25x, the base which will not have more than 30 moa...It is what it is, and that is damn good propaganda.

Greetings,

NK.
 
Re: British sniper breaks Rob Furlong's record

Sandwarrior,

there is a HUGE difference between a standard 338lm with a 250 grain scenar which the Brits are using, or a 408 with a 419 grain cnc bullit...
And the BC difference is just the small part; .675 compared to the .915 or more (depending on the bullit).

The AWM really is a great weapon system, but in its own range.

If someone is saying he can hit 3 cans of coke at 300m with 3 consecutive shots out of a 9mm MP5 he would be called a damned liar. If the same person would say the same thing but with a 308 bolt action (any half moa rifle) than every body would go...hm, yeah, that might be do-able.

Apples and peers.

NK.