Everyday Sniper Podcast: Knowledge Bomb Edition: Rise of the Valkyrie

[John Glidewell]

I run N550 in my 224V. 26 grains gets me 2830 and 27.5 gets 2960 with 80.5 Bergers in Starline brass with CCI 400 primers. 27.5 is a warm load, near max. Think I might try the N555 with 90 SMKs and see what I can get with those, might be too slow burning for the 224V. I also run N550 in the 22GT and 90 SMKs, nice load running 3085. I can get 3130 with N555 but it is 2 full grains more than the N550 load, it is slightly compressed and I am not sure the little bit of speed is worth it.

N550 is temp sensitive, we tested it. I keep the ammo box in the cooler - not on ice - upper tray of cooler to maintain a 70ish degree temp. Shoots great but it is temp sensitive.

I am going to be trying the 22GT later this year as a match rig, right now I will stick with the 6mm. The issue with running the 224V in matches is impacts at distance. As mentioned already, it becomes difficult to see impacts around 750 and out and we do not use hit indicators. I kept it as a trainer, lots of fun to shoot and a great cartridge to teach people.

 

[mahlv]

Pretty much knew frank was right on the varget deal with this cartridge, but that's all I have in the way of powder right now. I got decent speeds and plenty accurate loads with varget, but at the cost of hammering the brass. I'm gonna shelve it until I can find some more suitable powder, rl17 is what I'd like to try, so if I come across a pound somewhere I'll get back on it.

 

[Jackomason]

Pretty much knew frank was right on the varget deal with this cartridge, but that's all I have in the way of powder right now. I got decent speeds and plenty accurate loads with varget, but at the cost of hammering the brass. I'm gonna shelve it until I can find some more suitable powder, rl17 is what I'd like to try, so if I come across a pound somewhere I'll get back on it.

It doesn't help that brass has disappeared... I'm considering buying those 90gr factory seconds just to get the brass.

 

[mahlv]

Just the little testing I did, using hornady brass (1X fired factory match, crimped primers), and new federal brass, I am far from impressed with the federal brass. I do feel inclined like @Jackomason to drop the hammer on that federal ammo though, just to have something to shoot, and then worst case have brass for one loading and just trash it.

 

[Lowlight]

I would bet, both the Federal and Hornady are the same brass,

I have been to Hornady, they have an entire section where they make Federal Brass, not sure if it's specific calibers only but I would suspect you are talking the same stuff

 

[Diverhunter]

The barrel is getting spun up right now for my bolt 224. I did have some encouraging results in my gaser running 88's with StaBall @2730.

 

[VSP968]

Midsouth is back ordering Hornady 224V brass:

224 Valkyrie Unprimed Rifle Brass 50 Count

224 Valkyrie Unprimed Rifle Brass 50 Count by HORNADY Product Overview: At Hornady, brass is the foundation for what could be the most memorable shot of your lifetime. Extra time and care is taken in the creation of their cases, producing smaller lots that meet strict quality...

www.midsouthshooterssupply.com

 

[mahlv]

I would bet, both the Federal and Hornady are the same brass,

I have been to Hornady, they have an entire section where they make Federal Brass, not sure if it's specific calibers only but I would suspect you are talking the same stuff

The stuff I had, comparatively speaking, was quite a bit different on case capacity. That could have been other factors than just hornady vs. federal. My hornady brass is once fired in the same rifle, so I could buy that those cases were expanded slightly compared to the new federal stuff I have. Just from looking at where each charge weight filled the case, it was clear that the fed brass would hold a little more volume-wise, and I did see quite a difference in velocity between the two brands with the same charge weight of powder(hornady brass reached pressure signs sooner than the Federal). I know I'd be fine backing down to lower node and kid gloving it in order to save brass, but at that point I'd be no better than the factory offerings, plus, I'm a child and have to chase the velocity lol!

 

[mahlv]

I'm seeing Winchester 760 powder available, and in Sierra's online load data for the 224V, it looks like it builds velocity pretty safely. Any experience with this powder? I'm gonna get a pound and try it out.

 

[Jackomason]

I'm seeing Winchester 760 powder available, and in Sierra's online load data for the 224V, it looks like it builds velocity pretty safely. Any experience with this powder? I'm gonna get a pound and try it out.

I've got a pound on my shelf. What weight bullets were you curious about?

 

[mahlv]

88gr eldm and 90gr vld

 

[Jackomason]

Just got back from shooting the Pikes peak precision match with the valkyrie. I kept up just fine with everyone in my squad and didn't feel like I lost any points due to the caliber. I've been able to shoot this thing a lot so I felt pretty good about wind calls and every T1000 went off with two of the targets being at 1033 and 1079. Wind seemed to stick around 15mph, nice calm day compared to what we've been having.

I brought a friend that shot my rifle as well and he did well with it. Heat wasn't a problem for us either. Super happy with it. Again finding myself wondering why I'd ever spin my other barrels on.

My friend is planning a 223 AI, I don't see why not.

ETA: looks like I got 11th out of 31. Not bad for my first match.

 

[VSP968]

Midway has 85.5 Bergers in stock:

Berger Hybrid Target Bullets 22 Cal (224 Diameter) 85.5 Grain Hollow

The Berger Long Range Hybrid Target Bullet features an improved center of gravity and ballistic coefficient. Utilizing advanced and proprietary...

www.midwayusa.com

 

[Jackomason]

I think it's worth noting that starline has started fulfilling backorders and now has backorders open on their website. I just put down for 500.

 

[357Max]

I think it's worth noting that starline has started fulfilling backorders and now has backorders open on their website. I just put down for 500.

Thanks Jack! Ordered 500. Must have just opened this morning. I was getting desperate & forming 24 Nosler brass.

 

[mahlv]

I think it's worth noting that starline has started fulfilling backorders and now has backorders open on their website. I just put down for 500.

I ordered 1000 that day, and I just got tracking info today! Thanks for the heads up

 

[Jackomason]

I ordered 1000 that day, and I just got tracking info today! Thanks for the heads up

Good call. I got tracking too but I wasn't sure what for! I think with how gentle I've been on brass I can get away with less but 1k seems about perfect for a barrel.

 

[VSP968]

So I got a notification late Saturday night that Midway had thousand count boxes of Berger 224 85.5 bullets. I ordered a box right away. By the following afternoon, they were out of stock again, with no back orders.
Today UPS delivered my box of Berger bullets.
Instead of receiving Berger PN 22785 (1K 224 85.5) I received Berger PN 24785 (500 243 109).
Foiled again!

 

[JM4590]

 

[TNSleeper99]

So I got a notification late Saturday night that Midway had thousand count boxes of Berger 224 85.5 bullets. I ordered a box right away. By the following afternoon, they were out of stock again, with no back orders.
Today UPS delivered my box of Berger bullets.
Instead of receiving Berger PN 22785 (1K 224 85.5) I received Berger PN 24785 (500 243 109).
Foiled again!

View attachment 7872327

Those are pretty desirable right now, I’m sure you can pass them on.

 

[VSP968]

The only problem with that is box of 1000 88.5s goes for almost $500 and a box of 500 109s goes for almost $300. (From Midway)
The return label is printed and they’re going back tomorrow.

 

[Diverhunter]

Going to work on this one a little. 100 rounds on the barrel of this new bolt gun. Can't get much more in the case and there were no signs of pressure.

 

[mahlv]

Starline keepin the valkyrie alive in this household!

 

[TNSleeper99]

Starline keepin the valkyrie alive in this household!
View attachment 7873041

Got mine today too! Hope they keep making them for the foreseeable future!

 

[Jackomason]

Got mine today too! Hope they keep making them for the foreseeable future!

Get enough for your barrel while it's infront of you! I'm with frank in thinking that it's mostly dead now. But I freakin love my valkyrie.

I think I'll be going to a 223 AI next, but the valkyrie has taught me a lot about the capabilities of a 22 cal bullet.

I hope the 224v and 22 Nos aren't the last efforts of the industry in this area.

 

[TNSleeper99]

Get enough for your barrel while it's infront of you! I'm with frank in thinking that it's mostly dead now. But I freakin love my valkyrie.

I think I'll be going to a 223 AI next, but the valkyrie has taught me a lot about the capabilities of a 22 cal bullet.

I hope the 224v and 22 Nos aren't the last efforts of the industry in this area.

I probably have around 1500 pieces between fed/Hornady/ and now starline. I didn’t keep tabs on this barrel as it’s mostly my practice, training barrel. I think it’s probably at about 3K rounds or so at this point. I think I gave away at least 1k of the Hornady back when I was shooting the 88 factory stuff and before I decided to reload.

 

[JM4590]

Ok, as promised, results thus far with Valk out to distance.
Shot today here in Va. Temp was a sweltering 93, and unlike you lucky bastards out west, we gots tons of humidity to go along with the heat. I was melting on the stock.
So I attached a photo of the course of fire. The numbers are what I held, and what I was off. As you can see the 1020, the 1100, the 850 and the 1000, my impacts were about .5 mil above my point of aim. The exception was the 850. I was only .1-.2 high. But anything past 850and I was definitely shooting high. Now, it would be nice if I could shoot multiple rounds at the targets, but alas, we get two shots per target. I am still confident that my dope was ~.5 high at 1000 and beyond.
My load was with MR2000 and chrono at the sight in showed 2929 with an SD of about 8.5. These were with Berger 80.5 FB. I shot two relays of the same targets. A total of 40 rnds. I hit each target at least once between the two relays. Out of the four shots at eggs at 200, I hit 3! Shout out to NF and the 7x35 ATACR! So I think an egg at 200 is prob .5 MOA right? The eggs are hanging from strings and sway a bit,so timing is everything.

So, not convinced that the 80.5’s are the way to go in the bolt Valk. Also not confident of the temp stability in MR2000. There was a slight breeze today that was switching back and forth. I plan to shoot the same load this next weekend at another match. For now, I’m not going to change anything except my dope in my Kestrel to true it up. Adjusted the BC to match results at 1000 and beyond. Following the next weekends performance I will decide if I will stay the course with the 80.5 or experiment more with the Sierra and Hornady 90 grnrs. However, regardless of what I do, I for one do NOT believe 2900+ with 90grn bullets will be achievable in the Valkyrie. If this is what you want to do then I think I try would look at the 22 GT. The load I posted previously with the A-Tips was pretty stout, and I would be a little afraid to try them in something like the heat I had today. But hell, if you ain’t afraid of some blown primers and a wooden stick to knock the bolt open, give it a go. OR, perhaps someone will come across a powder that will drive the 90’s at 2900+.

If anyone wants more details or clarification, PM me and I will try to answer. No point in extending the thread any more than what we have.

 

[Jackomason]

Ok, as promised, results thus far with Valk out to distance.
Shot today here in Va. Temp was a sweltering 93, and unlike you lucky bastards out west, we gots tons of humidity to go along with the heat. I was melting on the stock.
View attachment 7874827So I attached a photo of the course of fire. The numbers are what I held, and what I was off. As you can see the 1020, the 1100, the 850 and the 1000, my impacts were about .5 mil above my point of aim. The exception was the 850. I was only .1-.2 high. But anything past 850and I was definitely shooting high. Now, it would be nice if I could shoot multiple rounds at the targets, but alas, we get two shots per target. I am still confident that my dope was ~.5 high at 1000 and beyond.
My load was with MR2000 and chrono at the sight in showed 2929 with an SD of about 8.5. These were with Berger 80.5 FB. I shot two relays of the same targets. A total of 40 rnds. I hit each target at least once between the two relays. Out of the four shots at eggs at 200, I hit 3! Shout out to NF and the 7x35 ATACR! So I think an egg at 200 is prob .5 MOA right? The eggs are hanging from strings and sway a bit,so timing is everything.

So, not convinced that the 80.5’s are the way to go in the bolt Valk. Also not confident of the temp stability in MR2000. There was a slight breeze today that was switching back and forth. I plan to shoot the same load this next weekend at another match. For now, I’m not going to change anything except my dope in my Kestrel to true it up. Adjusted the BC to match results at 1000 and beyond. Following the next weekends performance I will decide if I will stay the course with the 80.5 or experiment more with the Sierra and Hornady 90 grnrs. However, regardless of what I do, I for one do NOT believe 2900+ with 90grn bullets will be achievable in the Valkyrie. If this is what you want to do then I think I try would look at the 22 GT. The load I posted previously with the A-Tips was pretty stout, and I would be a little afraid to try them in something like the heat I had today. But hell, if you ain’t afraid of some blown primers and a wooden stick to knock the bolt open, give it a go. OR, perhaps someone will come across a powder that will drive the 90’s at 2900+.

If anyone wants more details or clarification, PM me and I will try to answer. No point in extending the thread any more than what we have.

Yup, I think the only way to achieve those magical numbers would be to switch to copper solids... I might give them a go just because but I think we all know that it's not realistic to spend $0.90 a bullet.

With that said, thanks for another data point. I've got win 760 and 88gr eldm that I'd like to shoot for you guys but my chrono is out for the next few days.

I really think we've peaked with 80/88gr eldm and h4895. There might be better 600 and in loads though. Still planning on ordering some 69gr RMR bullets and getting them screaming just for a PD load.

 

[357Max]

Yup, I think the only way to achieve those magical numbers would be to switch to copper solids... I might give them a go just because but I think we all know that it's not realistic to spend $0.90 a bullet.

With that said, thanks for another data point. I've got win 760 and 88gr eldm that I'd like to shoot for you guys but my chrono is out for the next few days.

I really think we've peaked with 80/88gr eldm and h4895. There might be better 600 and in loads though. Still planning on ordering some 69gr RMR bullets and getting them screaming just for a PD load.

Not sure if @JM4590 is shooting bolt gun or AR?

I haven’t tried a powder yet that will match the speed Lever delivers in the Valk for 77+gr bullets. That said 2900 does seem out of reach for the 88’s

Shot some Lever yesterday @93 degrees. Temp stability wasn’t as bad as I expected. Last time out it was 53degrees.
80.5 Bergers at Mag length 2.270 = 2918 SD 8.1
88 ELD loaded long in windowed mag 2744 SD 11.8
These are stout loads in the heat, but didn’t loose or blank any primers. Brass passed primer go/nogo check after.
AR with 18” Barrel.


60gr Vmax with 26.5 8208XBR @ 2.190coal is running 3231fps from my 18” AR. I don’t think the PD would like that at all.

I’ve been shooting the 69 RMR’s to fire form the 24 Nosler brass. Shoots surprisingly well considering how much run out they have. Haven’t tried shooting a group with them, but haven’t had any problems connecting with steel @400 while forming. The rmr tips are clogged with cat litter so not ideal for hunting. They have a note explaining the cat litter on their site.

 

[TNSleeper99]

Not sure if @JM4590 is shooting bolt gun or AR?

I haven’t tried a powder yet that will match the speed Lever delivers in the Valk for 77+gr bullets. That said 2900 does seem out of reach for the 88’s

Shot some Lever yesterday @93 degrees. Temp stability wasn’t as bad as I expected. Last time out it was 53degrees.
80.5 Bergers at Mag length 2.270 = 2918 SD 8.1
88 ELD loaded long in windowed mag 2744 SD 11.8
These are stout loads in the heat, but didn’t loose or blank any primers. Brass passed primer go/nogo check after.
AR with 18” Barrel.


60gr Vmax with 26.5 8208XBR @ 2.190coal is running 3231fps from my 18” AR. I don’t think the PD would like that at all.

I’ve been shooting the 69 RMR’s to fire form the 24 Nosler brass. Shoots surprisingly well considering how much run out they have. Haven’t tried shooting a group with them, but haven’t had any problems connecting with steel @400 while forming. The rmr tips are clogged with cat litter so not ideal for hunting. They have a note explaining the cat litter on their site.

2900fps should definitely be doable in a 26” bolt gun. I got close to there with h4895 and a 24” tube. Federal brass was a little loose after but still holds primers well enough.

 

[Jackomason]

Just realized that with Frank's cheap 90gr federal 2nds I could skip the whole power factor issue and run my Valk in NRL hunter.

 

[Diverhunter]

Just realized that with Frank's cheap 90gr federal 2nds I could skip the whole power factor issue and run my Valk in NRL hunter.

I think you would have to run a factory gun then as well, but I might be mistaken.

 

[Diverhunter]

Got a little over 200rds through the new bolt gun. Here is where I'm stopping on this load. I had ever slight case head rub but not heavy bolt lift. The wind is blowing 18 and gusting over 25 which had my gun moving around a little. For a temp stabile load, for the powders that I have, I think this works. FYI....5 shots @100yds

 

[VSP968]

Success! And $100 cheaper than Midway; they gave me a full refund.

 

[Diverhunter]

Success! And $100 cheaper than Midway; they gave me a full refund.

View attachment 7878858

I've got some that will be here Tuesday.

 

[VSP968]

Added to my stock of Starline 224V brass. More testing at 1K this Sunday.

 

[TNSleeper99]

Midsouth has the 85.5 Hybrids in stock. If any of you are wanting get ahold of some.

 

[VSP968]

So I got back out on Range 4 today with a bunch of 85.5 Bergers I’d loaded in twice fired Federal brass as part of a brass longevity test. I had 55 pieces I’d primed and five pieces didn’t make the priming cut. I think three firings is max on Fed 224V brass…
I’d used 25gr of Varget on my last outing with this brass two weeks ago but the results were less than stellar so I threw caution to the wind and tried 25gr of RL15.

Fed brass
205M
85.5 Berger Hybrid
25.0 RL15
COAL 2.420 CBTO 1.865
2785 AV
73F DA 800

I decided I’d true my Kestrel @ 700 yards while using the chronograph . I dialed 4.9M (17.0MOA) and proceeded to smack the shit out of my 66% IPSIC at 700

Moving on to 1K I dialed 9.1M (31MOA) and had a first round hit (and many subsequent hits on my 75% IPSIC.

(Hi and low hits on both targets are my buddies 6.5x47)

Wind was negligible, about 5-8mph right to left. I held high left. This rifle is FUN!
No recoil and it’s like shooting a pop gun with a Nightforce….
Shot some 95SMKs over RL17 and the results were about the same.

Later I moved over to the right side of the range and shot a variously sized pieces of steel that @Defender3 had set out at random distances from about 600 to 800 yards. I didn’t hit them all fist round but I did hit them all. Big fun!

 

[Lowlight]

I’m loving this stuff !!!

 

[Diverhunter]

Doped the Valkyrie to 800yds with the 85.5 Bergers running 2896fps....

3 shots @700 yards

2 shoots @800 yards

 

[Jackomason]

Doped the Valkyrie to 800yds....

View attachment 7886817

I guess it helps that I live and shoot at about 10k ft.

 

[Lowlight]

Ya I think I am even 8.2 if I remember right that is fast

 

[VSP968]

@Diverhunter and @Jackomason , what are the loads that you’re shooting?

 

[Jackomason]

@Diverhunter and @Jackomason , what are the loads that you’re shooting?

23.1gr H4895, 88gr eldm, starline brass and CCI br4.

2750fps out of a 26" 1:7

This load is lights out when it's tuned but one lot change with screw you. I went from one hole to 3/4" just with bullets changing.

 

[Diverhunter]

@Diverhunter and @Jackomason , what are the loads that you’re shooting?

25gr XBR, 85.5gr berger, starline brass and 205m primers 1.850 to ogive.

2896fps, sd 8

26" 1:7 Mueller Works 4 groove

 

[Lowlight]

NICE !! 2896fps... beauty numbers

 

[John Glidewell]

I think I will test some RL15.5 in mine. Just looking over what folks run in the 224v vs a GT and it looks like the 15.5 will be a nice match for the heavier projectiles in the 224v. It will have to wait till next month. 3 matches this month and I want to focus on those. Has anyone else run RL 15.5 in the 224v yet?

 

[Diverhunter]

NICE !! 2896fps... beauty numbers

Thanks....only verified to 800 at this point......numbers are showing 8.4 @1k. This is in central IL.

 

[Jackomason]

Alright boys, I'm ready to toast some brass (while keeping my face)

Here are some of the powders that I have on hand that I think may fit in the burn rate window for the valkyrie. Some of these are well documented to be decent powders in the 223AI and 224 valkyrie. Some haven't lol. Here's what I've got.

These powders were not set out in any particular order but are book ended on the burn rate chart by H335 and H4350 (maybe N555). H335 is the only one I'm hesitant about...

To make this quick I'll do .3gr increment 10 shot strings and call that good enough. This will only be a velocity/case yield test. I may shoot at dots but shooting suppressed with a magnetospeed makes groups kinda pointless. There are a lot of powders I wish I had on hand but I realize I'm doing better than most. I'd love to see more data on 2000 MR and 8208 xbr in my rifle.

With that said I've got a .115" freebore in an origin build. so I'm hoping to stuff a little extra powder under that bullet when I need to.

 

[TNSleeper99]

Alright boys, I'm ready to toast some brass (while keeping my face)

Here are some of the powders that I have on hand that I think may fit in the burn rate window for the valkyrie. Some of these are well documented to be decent powders in the 223AI and 224 valkyrie. Some haven't lol. Here's what I've got. View attachment 7889876
These powders were not set out in any particular order but are book ended on the burn rate chart by H335 and H4350 (maybe N555). H335 is the only one I'm hesitant about...

To make this quick I'll do .3gr increment 10 shot strings and call that good enough. This will only be a velocity/case yield test. I may shoot at dots but shooting suppressed with a magnetospeed makes groups kinda pointless. There are a lot of powders I wish I had on hand but I realize I'm doing better than most. I'd love to see more data on 2000 MR and 8208 xbr in my rifle.

With that said I've got a .115" freebore in an origin build. so I'm hoping to stuff a little extra powder under that bullet when I need to.

Looking forward to your results! Keep us posted. I’ve tried cfe223, h4895, h4350. My most consistent load with the best velocity was with h4895, but I’m curious to see what you come up with.