New GAP Extreme Hunter in 6.5 SAUM

#2,451
#2,452
Well finally got the 6.5 to shoot. I could not get consistent groups, and groups without big flyers. Also was having bad pressure issues. Well come to find out it was a bad barrel. I put around 250 rounds down it before i gave up. Moon put on a new barrel and the thing shoots. I just took it out this mourning with only 30 rounds down the new barrel so far. After reading that some of you guys are having problems getting their guns to shoot as well. I went back and turn my necks down even more. Now after I fire a round and can put a bullet back in the case, but it is snug. Before there was no way of doing that by hand. I don't know if this helped but it shooting now.

Bighorn SR2 Action
GAP 4s reamer Print # 54565 Freebore .081
24 inch Bartlein sendero 1-8.5 Cryoed by 300 below
APA little Bastard
APA rings
APA bottom metal
McMillan A3 Edge
jewel trigger

Remington brass, CCI-BR2, H1000, Berger 130vlds COAL 2.880

Started 59.5 H1000 ended at 62g



4 shots 60g H1000


4 Shots 61.5 H1000


4 Shots 62 H1000
 
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#2,453
Skyking said:
Well finally got the 6.5 to shoot. I could not get consistent groups, and groups without big flyers. Also was having bad pressure issues. Well come to find out it was a bad barrel. I put around 250 rounds down it before i gave up. Moon put on a new barrel and the thing shoots. I just took it out this mourning with only 30 rounds down the new barrel so far. After reading that some of you guys are having problems getting their guns to shoot as well. I went back and turn my necks down even more. Now after I fire a round and can put a bullet back in the case, but it is snug. Before there was no way of doing that by hand. I don't know if this helped but it shooting now.

Bighorn SR2 Action
GAP 4s reamer Print # 54565 Freebore .081
24 inch Bartlein sendero 1-8.5
APA little Bastard
APA rings
APA bottom metal
McMillan A3 Edge
jewel trigger

Remington brass, CCI-BR2, H1000, Berger 130vlds COAL 2.880

Started 59.5 H1000 ended at 62g



4 shots 60g H1000


4 Shots 61.5 H1000


4 Shots 62 H1000
Click to expand...
Nice shooting and I'm glad you figured it out. Nothing like a bad barrel and all the time spent on load work ups!
 
#2,455
Skyking said:
Well finally got the 6.5 to shoot. I could not get consistent groups, and groups without big flyers. Also was having bad pressure issues. Well come to find out it was a bad barrel. I put around 250 rounds down it before i gave up. Moon put on a new barrel and the thing shoots. I just took it out this mourning with only 30 rounds down the new barrel so far. After reading that some of you guys are having problems getting their guns to shoot as well. I went back and turn my necks down even more. Now after I fire a round and can put a bullet back in the case, but it is snug. Before there was no way of doing that by hand. I don't know if this helped but it shooting now.

Bighorn SR2 Action
GAP 4s reamer Print # 54565 Freebore .081
24 inch Bartlein sendero 1-8.5
APA little Bastard
APA rings
APA bottom metal
McMillan A3 Edge
jewel trigger

Remington brass, CCI-BR2, H1000, Berger 130vlds COAL 2.880

Started 59.5 H1000 ended at 62g
Click to expand...

Mind sharing what was wrong with the barrel? Also the maker and where you purchased it? I'm having major issues with mine.
 
#2,456
blackfoot said:
Mind sharing what was wrong with the barrel? Also the maker and where you purchased it? I'm having major issues with mine.
Click to expand...

It would not shoot. Had had bad flyers that would be 1-2 inches outside of the group. I has having pressure issues with it as well. I tried everything i know, as well as changing scopes, and every-other part of the gun to see if something else was going on. I bought the barrel off of Grizzle. Its a Bartlein barrel. I had been working with Moon my gun builder about the issues. He called Bartlein for me and they said they would warranty it. I sent the gun to Moon and he took care of it all for me. I think back on page 24-28 are my posts.
 
#2,457
Skyking said:
Well finally got the 6.5 to shoot. I could not get consistent groups, and groups without big flyers. Also was having bad pressure issues. Well come to find out it was a bad barrel. I put around 250 rounds down it before i gave up. Moon put on a new barrel and the thing shoots. I just took it out this mourning with only 30 rounds down the new barrel so far. After reading that some of you guys are having problems getting their guns to shoot as well. I went back and turn my necks down even more. Now after I fire a round and can put a bullet back in the case, but it is snug. Before there was no way of doing that by hand. I don't know if this helped but it shooting now.

Bighorn SR2 Action
GAP 4s reamer Print # 54565 Freebore .081
24 inch Bartlein sendero 1-8.5
APA little Bastard
APA rings
APA bottom metal
McMillan A3 Edge
jewel trigger

Remington brass, CCI-BR2, H1000, Berger 130vlds COAL 2.880

Started 59.5 H1000 ended at 62g



4 shots 60g H1000


4 Shots 61.5 H1000


4 Shots 62 H1000
Click to expand...

Good looking set-up - glad you got things worked out. What velocity's are you getting?
 
#2,461
I finally took my DTA 6.5 SAUM out to some distance. I got some DOPE at 900, cold bore hits on an 8" target were nothing for this load! After two shots there I said lets go out to a mile. 4 shots and 4 hits! I am so impressed with this round, it's my new favorite round. The big splatter mark is the .338 Norma Magnum hitting steel as well out of the DTA.
 

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#2,462
brado16 said:
Does anyone know of availability of 6.5 Saum FL Bushing Die sets? Gap, CC, and Redding have nothing available at the moment- also waiting to hear back from Whidden. I could also use some Berger 130 Hunting VLDS- Thanks in advance for any help!
Click to expand...

I'm impressed with the Whidden Dies, very consistent. 3 days ago Midway had 130 Bergers and 127 Barnes XLR's

Until that Day,
Darkop
 
#2,463
waveslayer said:
I finally took my DTA 6.5 SAUM out to some distance. I got some DOPE at 900, cold bore hits on an 8" target were nothing for this load! After two shots there I said lets go out to a mile. 4 shots and 4 hits! I am so impressed with this round, it's my new favorite round. The big splatter mark is the .338 Norma Magnum hitting steel as well out of the DTA.
Click to expand...


Nice shooting!
 
#2,469
Fongman said:
Always heard it was the other way around i.e. the Hunting VLDs have a thinner jacket, for better expansion.

I've shot them side by side and could not tell a poi difference. BUT it was only at 100 yards.
Click to expand...
You could be right. It's on the Berger website. I will double check now and report back

Yes I stand corrected. Thicker jackets on match bullets to help reduce the lead from melting and the thinner jacket is on the hunting VLD line. The original of the two.
http://www.bergerbullets.com/history-of-the-match-grade-berger-hunting-vld/
 
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#2,470
Graywolf.260 said:
How do you like that stock? I just picked up a .300 WSM...
Click to expand...
I like it. Two downsides, the action screws can only be tightened down to approx 20lbs or it will cause the mag to stick. 2nd is the fore end is very wide, so a stock Tikka barrel looks tiny in there.

Its a tad heavy at 3lbs, about 1lbs heavier than the OEM Tikka stock.

Its priced right at approx. $325 though, and the Tikka action fits great. Huge improvement over the OEM POS stock.
 
#2,471
I received the message below direct from Berger Bullets. It seems you can interchange them, I would be very interested to see if there are any POI differances at longer ranges. I ordered a box of 130 VLD target bullets to start working up a load.


Thank you for getting with us at Berger Bullets. You would indeed be able to work up your loads with the Match Target VLD bullet, and then use it for use with the Match Hunting VLD bullets. Please do not hesitate to get back with us if we can be of further assistance for you.

Kind Regards,
Berger Bullets Technical Support Team
[email protected]

4275 N. Palm Street
Fullerton, CA 92835

Tech Line: 714-447-7202
Fax: 714-441-7201
 
#2,473
My second 6.5 saum
Got this today
T3 action
24" bartlein no 3 fluted
Bedded into mcmillan hunter stock, edge tech
Dan hardy gen 4 suppressor
.298 reamer
Atlasworx tac bolt handle
Sako optilock low rings
Leupold vx6 3-18x44 illuminated Boone and crocket

gavajybu.jpg
 
#2,474
Skyking said:
Well finally got the 6.5 to shoot. I could not get consistent groups, and groups without big flyers. Also was having bad pressure issues. Well come to find out it was a bad barrel. I put around 250 rounds down it before i gave up. Moon put on a new barrel and the thing shoots. I just took it out this mourning with only 30 rounds down the new barrel so far. After reading that some of you guys are having problems getting their guns to shoot as well. I went back and turn my necks down even more. Now after I fire a round and can put a bullet back in the case, but it is snug. Before there was no way of doing that by hand. I don't know if this helped but it shooting now.

Bighorn SR2 Action
GAP 4s reamer Print # 54565 Freebore .081
24 inch Bartlein sendero 1-8.5 Cryoed by 300 below
APA little Bastard
APA rings
APA bottom metal
McMillan A3 Edge
jewel trigger

Remington brass, CCI-BR2, H1000, Berger 130vlds COAL 2.880

Started 59.5 H1000 ended at 62g



4 shots 60g H1000


4 Shots 61.5 H1000


4 Shots 62 H1000
Click to expand...


Nice!! Been messing with the new Accubond LR's seems they have a long bearing surface and dont make the speed of the bergers without pressure going way up.


Talked to Pat last week his rifle has 2800 rounds on it now and still hammers!! lost a little speed but accuracy is still there!
 
#2,475
So has anyone tried the 127LRX from Barnes? I still can't sell myself on a Berger in 130 or even 140 gr on a full-sized bull elk. I killed a medium bull at 500 yards last year with a 7WSM shooting the 140 Accubond @ 3150 as I was primarily hunting deer. To be honest I though perfomance was on the edge of inadequate. Two shots, two hits, first was broadside ahead of the liver back half of the lungs, NO EXIT. Second shot broadside 1/3 of the way up on the shoulder and dropped him. Bullet on backside bulging out the hide. Inconsistant might be a better word as I just don't understand not exiting on the first shot. Bullet wasn't recovered as I was perched on a steep hillside and we boned him out with no gutting. No problems in my mind with deer or even caribou on down, but an elk has some pretty stout shoulders to be pokin a Berger bomb into. Any thoughts???

Guess mainly even though it's BC isn't as good, the 127LRX I can picture putting into an elk at varied angles and getting the job done.
 
#2,479
George, I'm hearing some anecdotal stories around here that indicate hunters are not happy with the Accubond LR. Hearing they are blowing up at short distances, and that they are designed to open quickly at distance and not for game within 400 y. I will see the Nosler folks next week in Bend at the Crimson Trace match, I will ask them about that.

msalm - Here in Central MT, we've shot quite a few elk with the Accubonds, in just about every caliber, with good effect in everything from 7mm-08 to 300 RUM. However, we're usually using the highest SD bullet we can cram in there, so I'd think you'd want the 160 class rather than 140 in the 7mm. Honestly, I don't think there is any better combo for elk than a 7mm Mag and the 160 AB (or possibly the 168 Berger).

I've seen the 140 Accubonds work well on cows and smaller bull elk in the 6.5 and .270 calibers. I can't say those won't work on big bulls, I just haven't seen much of it yet as most of the bulls I've seen were taken with larger cals.

There may be some who have shot big bulls with the 140 AB and maybe 130 Berger who can share info. I'd really be interested in what the distances and the angle were.

If my 6.5 SAUM comes back from GAP in time, I plan on using the 130 Bergers on deer and 'lopes (pulled a loper tag..yay!) and 140 Accubonds on Elk. I pulled a cow tag, and I would think the 140 AB in the 6.5 SAUM would work great in that application, and might be fine on big bulls, we'll see how it goes. I don't think I'd try 130 Bergers on elk, that's just me, but others here may have and would have better input. I haven't heard of anyone around here using Bergers in that 130-140 class on elk, but there might be some out there. I did see here where George shot a big black bear with the 130 Berger, that was impressive. Maybe he, Sendero or Psinclair or others, have shot big elk with the 130 Berger. Psinclair is from Glasgow and they certainly would have big bulls, and some long shots up there in the Breaks.

I do have several buddies who swear by the 168 Bergers in 7mm Mags, and have kilt several trophy class bulls with that combo.

The bottom line with big bull elk is that its a bit of a gamble anytime you shoot one. I'm sure someone will jump in here and remind me about all the Scandinavian moose taken with the 6.5 sweede - whatever. I don't know anything about Scandinavian Moose, and I'm not claiming to be an expert on Rocky Mountain elk, but I have hunted them for 37 of my 45 years and live around them year round. I'm around 4-12 dead ones a year, sometimes more. I've seen them go down to .243s shooting cheap bullets, and I've seen them shake off 300 WMs. Hell, I killed a young bull in June with a 9mm pistol because some Ahole left it in the middle of the interstate to die. The question is from what distance are you shooting that elk, what angle, and do you want to give yourself the best chance at putting it down without a sh*& show. I know several guys who hunt elk with 6.5 sweede and similar calibers, and they do great on cows and small bulls, but the question is big bulls and at what distance. Maybe over time, we'll learn that the 6.5mm 140 AB kills big elk dead at whatever distance you want to shoot them at, but at least in the circles I run in, hunters currently prefer the bigger calibers for big bulls, especially if you might be taking a longer shot (which can be common here).

Bullet placement, angle of shot, and distance you are shooting are just some of the many key factors. Modern bullets like the Accubond and Bergers are big improvements over many of the bullets of the past, but they all can fail. I think you have to look at what the bullet was designed to do and how the bullet performs over a wide range of samples. Maybe someone from Berger can jump in here, but I'd be surprised if the 130 Berger was designed with big bull elk in mind. I'd go with the 160 AB in your 7mm, and 140 AB if you are going to go after elk with the 6.5 SAUM.

Hope that helps and wish you good luck on your elk hunt. I'm super excited to hunt with the 6.5 SAUM this year, and very interested to see how these bullets perform in that caliber.
 
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#2,480
I've run the 127 LRX in my 6.5-284 around 3050-3100 fps for the past two seasons. Can't speak for Elk, but it is absolutely devastating on deer and hogs.

It is my go to 6.5 hunting bullet, just need to keep the impact velocities up there.
 
#2,481
I've shot a fair # of elk in the past and do tend to go bigger. My favorite so far is the 200gr Accubond out of my 300 RUM...it does a phenominal job, as far as 1180 yards on a mulie several years ago and the bullet entered broadside on the top of the heart, good expansion, of course an exit, and when dressing out the good sized buck the heart came out with no knife work, top was completely missing. Also killed elk with it out to 850 with perfect performance. As mentioned, the 140gr Accubond was used as I was primarily out for deer but ended up just carrying the 7mm for the week. Did a GREAT job another good sized mulie at 375, the elk @ 500 was just a little too less bullet for my taste. I'm in the process of building two 6.5 4s' at the moment, one for a good friend and the topic of suitable bullets for an all-around rifle for a week's hunt out west has been dominating the conversation. I have a pile of 127 LRX's on hand, 140 and 130 Berger Hunting's and I am suggesting the 127 for the elk. Where we hunt if you're going for your deer, you're pretty much just going to see deer so I was suggesting work up a 130gr load, get it doped out and dead nutz, then shoot the 127 and make note of any trajectory/zero differences. Go shoot your buck and then switch ammo. PITA?, probably... Doable? I'm hoping we're pleasantly suprised at the POI between the two bullets and it will just take a different ballistic chart for each with no or little change in zero. His rifle is on a Rem Model Seven, Rock fluted #3 bbl 24", B&C Medalist lghtwt sporter. Picked up several leftover model seven 300 Blackout actions for a good price and opening up the boltface, installing m16 style extractor (no bushing required), and fluting barrel and bolt got the complete rifle to 6 1/2 lbs sans scope. With the Wyat's center feed box and flat follower it's a 3 shot rifle, and that's sufficient. Should be a great carry gun for out there but we've been trying to weigh the large mule deer buck/trophy bull bullet pro's and con's. Just got the stock complete, so I'll have it together tonight and it's ready to shoot. He's leaning towards the 140 Berger, I'm pushing towards something with heavier construction... I would imagine the Accubonds all have a longer bearing but the bc's aren't bad...may be the one to try in the 140 6.5, better S.D. than the 7mm I used last year. BTW I did realize beforehand the bullet was on the lighter side, and chose my shots pretty carefully (is there any other way?). Hell, I have a pile of hornady 140gr interlocks that would probably work decent for that matter, but then you're leaving the bc back there and that's not why we're building these rifles...

Well that's about enough rambling, bottom line would be, what bullet would you choose given that elk are on the table along with mule deer? In the area we hunt our shots have averaged on the other side of 300 yards if that makes a difference.

Oh and I'm out this year for elk hunting, got a baby due about that time and I'll be taking the year off, doesn't stop me from building a few new toys for next year though. I've hunted elk quite a few years starting in '93 and have done pretty damnded good for DIY non-resident hunting public land. In fact I have filled every rifle tag I've had in my pocket (9 so far). I've shot elk with the 06, 300 WSM, and 300 RUM (and bow), I understand the bigger is better for elk. I won't use the 160 AB in that 7WSM as that's not what I built the rifle for, but I will be shooting that bullet in a lightweight 7 Dakota I'm putting together... Have a few boxes sitting here waiting for it along with the dies and brass. My buddy on the other hand will be going without me (bastids) and will have his new 6.5 in hand. We're just brainstorming the better choices...
 
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#2,482
Sorry msalm, I didn't even mention Barnes in my response and agree with everything you said. I have had amazing terminal performance from Barnes bullets, and have never heard anything but good things around here in terms of how they perform on game. However, I moved away from them because the load data (and many times my zero) was so different than other loads, and sometimes it was hard for me to find an accurate load.

My personal experience with the Accubonds is the exact opposite. In several difference calibers, in many different guns (mine and friends) they generally shoot very well and load development was easy. Occasionally they won't shoot in someone's gun, but it seems to be the exception.

If you only had one gun/load in your 6.5 SAUM for out here, I'd vote for the 140 Accubond if it were me. I think with the higher SD it will perform better than your 140 7mm, and I wonder if the Accubond wouldn't have a closer zero than a Barnes. At ranges around the 300 yard neighborhood, I would think either the 140 AB or the Barnes would work fine, even on bulls, if the bullet is in the right place. I'm not sure I'd shoot a big bull with that combo at 500+ either, but maybe I'll learn different when I get my 6.5 SAUM and start hunting with it, and others here share more of their experiences.

BTW, I too use a 300 RUM with 200 AB for elk. It's bigger than I'd like, and more gun than you really need on elk, but a buddy practically gave it to me. If I'm considering shooting an elk at 600-800+y...I am glad for the extra boom stick.
 
#2,483
6,5x55 in sweden and on moose, tend to be short range, sub 100 meters, 160 grain bullets, typically a shot animal will travel anything from 25 to 400 meters, as we almost always both hunt and track with dogs it is not an issue, they will be found, furthermore the land is fore the most part agricultural and allows the use of quads bike or tractor for recovery. Chris
 
#2,484
Hawk Gunner said:
I have an elk hunt in a few months. With 130 bergers impossible to find. What's a good alternative besides the 127 lrx
Click to expand...

I would take a serious look at the 139gr Scenar. I killed an elk last year with that bullet (at 260 velocities) and it punched through both shoulders leaving a perfect exit. Impressive performance.
 
#2,485
Advokaten said:
6,5x55 in sweden and on moose, tend to be short range, sub 100 meters, 160 grain bullets, typically a shot animal will travel anything from 25 to 400 meters, as we almost always both hunt and track with dogs it is not an issue, they will be found, furthermore the land is fore the most part agricultural and allows the use of quads bike or tractor for recovery. Chris
Click to expand...

Wow, that is great info. I've often wondered what it was like hunting there, and that is completely different than hunting here. In MT shots can range from 25y to 1000y (limited by the obvious factors). The average shot I've taken over the last 7 years has been 300-400y, some out to 500+. I've had many shot opportunities from 500-1000 but have generally been able to get closer. Our topography is a mix of wide open mountainous spaces and dense forest. No dogs allowed, so if your shot elk takes off, it can be the heretofore mentioned sh$& show. They can hop a fence onto private land, or run up and over a couple ridgelines and never be found, or if you do find them, greatly increase the distance and difficulty you have to drag/pack them out.

Thanks for the reply Advokaten
 
#2,487
Huntr said:
I would take a serious look at the 139gr Scenar. I killed an elk last year with that bullet (at 260 velocities) and it punched through both shoulders leaving a perfect exit. Impressive performance.
Click to expand...


^^^^What he said....I've used that one to kill a good number of big game animals with a .260, and 6.5 SAUM. It's a real bone crusher.
 
#2,491
Grand said:
Is anyone running the 6.5 SAUM without a Brake?
Click to expand...

My Brake is removable so I don't totally wreck my (or the dogs) ears when bush stalking
Currently shooting 127LRX under a compressed load of 64gn Retumbo.
Still doing load delvelopment as the rifle is new. Also will be suppressed eventually
 
#2,493
Skyking said:
It would not shoot. Had had bad flyers that would be 1-2 inches outside of the group. I has having pressure issues with it as well. I tried everything i know, as well as changing scopes, and every-other part of the gun to see if something else was going on. I bought the barrel off of Grizzle. Its a Bartlein barrel. I had been working with Moon my gun builder about the issues. He called Bartlein for me and they said they would warranty it. I sent the gun to Moon and he took care of it all for me. I think back on page 24-28 are my posts.
Click to expand...

^^^^^^*******^^^^^^^
This right here is why I will continue to buy Bartlein barrels. Anyone does anything long enough and there will be mistakes "bad eggs". It's how a person or company handles them that makes the difference to me. It is awesome that they replaced the barrel under warranty. If you don't mind me asking were any of the smithing costs covered due to it being a bad barrel?
 
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