New Labradar LX

[sab567]

Ok so the usual SOP for they are known for…… I personally think a strategic move to wait for SHOT is a better story, than dragging their proverbial asses until Garmin lights a fire under said asses…… Work with me here

Once again, thank you Garmin!

Well the reality is that their team of 2 developped different products and software that is just not for our market. They are not the same size of Garmin or other big company, and they build their unit here, not all in china. So they cant do everything at once, they have to Split their energy between our market (the labradar Lx for example, or the other midsize that they didnt released during covid because they couldnt find parts to make it) and the bigger doppler market where the radars sells at couple hundred thousands.
I understand people would have like to see products available before.

 

[sab567]

So LR farms out their CS and still pays that same company to continue doing their CS?

I would like to have a better answer then saying Ill report what Ive read here to them and see what they are going to do with the Lx.
To be honest, Im not really à forum guy (you can see that looking at my profil) I come here couple times à year to check some load and talk about MB. The few guys I know had issues with their LR Ive help them get their unit fixed when needed and wasnt aware of the issues people are bringing here with the distributor. They had exclusive contract for the OG, so Ill see what it will be with the Lx. Im far from decision making, but the guys at LR do care about their customer, their image and they are smart enough to understand how customer fidelity work. They replace unit here that have expired warranty.
So anyway, it wont take 1 or 2 days of course, but Ill let them know. Hopefully things changes for the better.

 

[6.5SH]

I would like to have a better answer then saying Ill report what Ive read here to them and see what they are going to do with the Lx.
To be honest, Im not really à forum guy (you can see that looking at my profil) I come here couple times à year to check some load and talk about MB. The few guys I know had issues with their LR Ive help them get their unit fixed when needed and wasnt aware of the issues people are bringing here with the distributor. They had exclusive contract for the OG, so Ill see what it will be with the Lx. Im far from decision making, but the guys at LR do care about their customer, their image and they are smart enough to understand how customer fidelity work. They replace unit here that have expired warranty.
So anyway, it wont take 1 or 2 days of course, but Ill let them know. Hopefully things changes for the better.

Have they moved the app development in house?

 

[sab567]

Have they moved the app development in house?

I know they have been working on the app at the same time they were working on the software, I also know they were looking to hire a programmation enginer (dont know if its the right term) for that last year but I dont know if it happen (I dont know how it is in the US, but here its really hard to find workers since the Last 5 years, even worst good workers). But Ill ask after SHOT more details about bluethoot and apps, Im not really à fan of connecting my devices so I cant guide what the changes are yet, but Ill test it.

 

[Holliday]

Well the reality is that their team of 2 developped different products and software that is just not for our market. They are not the same size of Garmin or other big company, and they build their unit here, not all in china. So they cant do everything at once, they have to Split their energy between our market (the labradar Lx for example, or the other midsize that they didnt released during covid because they couldnt find parts to make it) and the bigger doppler market where the radars sells at couple hundred thousands.
I understand people would have like to see products available before.

Covid was 4 years ago. I run a small business. That excuse has been way over played.

You are talking about a company that has a track record with this industry, and not a good one.

You can say it differently six ways to Sunday BUT if not for Garmin we would still be waiting on them to pull their fingers out of their proverbial asses.

Really sounds to me like they and their spokespeople want to blow the same smoke that they have been blowing all along, rather than falling on bending knee and changing.

Consumers are asking for change, in fact, from what I can see in this thread, they are demanding it.

 

[SpeedyR]

I have to laugh a little about Garmin and the consensus on SH about them. I guess I've been using Garmin GPS units for close to 25-30 years now. I used one daily for many years (traveling) and had a lot of issues with the units but they were really the only game in town. Slow processors, glitches, screens, crap proprietary cards, etc. etc. Compared to a smart phone they were a total brick, but at the time they were (more) durable than the phones and for outdoor use (motorcycle, hiking, etc) that was the best you could get. But they always had issues and their updated models and software really were just bandaids for poor product planning. Again this was mostly the mobile GPS side of the business and not the high end aviation or other units. I went thru maybe 3 or 4 of the 276c units over the years, usually they would sell me a "refurbished" unit when mine would crap out. Good product but not great IMHO. So close in many cases but not there.

I guess my personal view of Garmin is a bit shaded by my previous experience, but I do have a newer Garmin watch that works well enough, and still have a backup Garmin GPS (Montana) for when I don't want to use one of my phones for navigation or on the bike.

would love to try out one of the Xero's and probably will at some point, but having talked to the guys at LR two years ago at Shot, will for sure take a look at the new unit once it's out and has some reviews out there on it since i don't currently have a Xero.

 

[Wall_Element]

which is precisely why we should all be rooting on continued competition in the space.

Garmin made the best offering in the market, but it wasn't on their own, unique to them or perfect. Many offerings starting emerging, and garmin was the first to make a true mass market version. It has gaps, there is much more maturing to go here, prices to drop, etc.

I am thrilled with my Garmin, but I am not sucking the Garmin cock over it.

As you pointed out, as have many others, Garmin does not have a great track record with updates on existing products. With Labradar offering a competitive solution, and, hopefully, many others in the business offering similar - we will have all the features, function and pricing we want in just a few years.

We aren't there yet boys. Let's not tickle the balls yet.

I have to laugh a little about Garmin and the consensus on SH about them. I guess I've been using Garmin GPS units for close to 25-30 years now. I used one daily for many years (traveling) and had a lot of issues with the units but they were really the only game in town. Slow processors, glitches, screens, crap proprietary cards, etc. etc. Compared to a smart phone they were a total brick, but at the time they were (more) durable than the phones and for outdoor use (motorcycle, hiking, etc) that was the best you could get. But they always had issues and their updated models and software really were just bandaids for poor product planning. Again this was mostly the mobile GPS side of the business and not the high end aviation or other units. I went thru maybe 3 or 4 of the 276c units over the years, usually they would sell me a "refurbished" unit when mine would crap out. Good product but not great IMHO. So close in many cases but not there.

I guess my personal view of Garmin is a bit shaded by my previous experience, but I do have a newer Garmin watch that works well enough, and still have a backup Garmin GPS (Montana) for when I don't want to use one of my phones for navigation or on the bike.

would love to try out one of the Xero's and probably will at some point, but having talked to the guys at LR two years ago at Shot, will for sure take a look at the new unit once it's out and has some reviews out there on it since i don't currently have a Xero.

 

[mikehill85]

I love how they say it is, "Made in North America". That means Mexico, doesn't it?

 

[sab567]

I love how they say it is, "Made in North America". That means Mexico, doesn't it?

As I said a few post earlier:

I can confirm, they are made in Trois-Riviere, Quebec, Canada, at the new facility of Infinition. I guess "made in north America" is a marketing affair, for some reason all the Canadian-Made (or at least Quebec-Made) product that I know of have a label of "Made in north America".

 

[mikehill85]

As I said a few post earlier:

I can confirm, they are made in Trois-Riviere, Quebec, Canada, at the new facility of Infinition. I guess "made in north America" is a marketing affair, for some reason all the Canadian-Made (or at least Quebec-Made) product that I know of have a label of "Made in north America".

Okay, it's still not the United States, which is more what I was getting at. They are saying, "Made in North America", hoping people will think they mean the United States. I mean, it's a marketing gimmick and all companies do it. It's just pretty obvious.
Anyway, it's a good thing that a competitor to the Garmin is coming out. The more competitors there are in the market, the more likely we are to see a price decrease/increase in features.

 

[sab567]

Okay, it's still not the United States, which is more what I was getting at. They are saying, "Made in North America", hoping people will think they mean the United States. I mean, it's a marketing gimmick and all companies do it. It's just pretty obvious.
Anyway, it's a good thing that a competitor to the Garmin is coming out. The more competitors there are in the market, the more likely we are to see a price decrease/increase in features.

Yeah I mean its obvious its not made in USA, but I think it also send the message of its not being made in China/Pakistan or other places.
Im quite happy, for myself, and proud they are made in my country

 

[6.5SH]

I love how they say it is, "Made in North America". That means Mexico, doesn't it?

Thank NAFTA for that.

 

[mikehill85]

Thank NAFTA for that.

Turns out I was wrong. It is made in Canada and LabRadar is a Canadian company. In any case, they are clearly trying to appeal to the U.S. market by calling it "Made in North America". It's just a very obvious marketing gimmick to try to trick Americans into thinking it is made in the U.S., otherwise they would just state it is "Made in Canada".

 

[Snuby642]

Well to be fair, I have an in dash Garmin that started asking me to pay for a map-update 6 months after I bought it.

It is still asking ……

Do not do a search, due to scammers and counterfeiters .

Manually type in "Garmin.com/Express" and check out what can be done for your unit, that goes for any unit they manufacture.

Again do not trust search engines results, type it in manually.

 

[Rio Precision Gunworks]

Well the reality is that their team of 2 developped different products and software that is just not for our market. They are not the same size of Garmin or other big company, and they build their unit here, not all in china. So they cant do everything at once, they have to Split their energy between our market (the labradar Lx for example, or the other midsize that they didnt released during covid because they couldnt find parts to make it) and the bigger doppler market where the radars sells at couple hundred thousands.
I understand people would have like to see products available before.

Let's just be real. The "reality" is that Labradar units have been finicky at best. So much so that many of us used dedicated recoil triggers. The aiming of many units was atrocious.

The consistency between units was ridiculous. Some would aim very easily, others not so much, and others completely needed the recoil triggers. All for the same rifles, same position, etc. I've lost count how many I personally know were sent back for microphone issues.

This was for the entire life of the product. Not the first batch. The app has been lacking for years, and again, finicky at best.

Literally all of this information is nothing new and you can find these complaints on every single forum and every single social media source everywhere. Infinition or any of their reps can make excuses and explanations all they want. But the fact is, the company did not change anything publicly. They didn't address anything publicly.


I think everyone will understand that small businesses have many challenges. But, you can't let what happened to consumer Labradar units *AND* then act as if everything was fine, or people should understand why the product was mediocre at best.



Infinition/Labradar would be far better off not allowing any public statements that amount to excuses. Just say they understand they didn't live up to customer expectations and they will work on doing better going forward. Anything else is smoke and insulting.

 

[sab567]

Infinition/Labradar would be far better off not allowing any public statements that amount to excuses. Just say they understand they didn't live up to customer expectations and they will work on doing better going forward. Anything else is smoke and insulting.

Am I understanding that you suggest, for someone in my position, who have no commercial or professional link with Labradar/infition, not to give information I have about them to people who don't ?
I'm not here to excuse them or whatever you try to say, I'm just reading the comments, giving feedback where I can, both to our community and to infinition/Labradar to improve.
Honestly my only goal here is to help, both party to improve. If noone really care I can just stop posting I'm fine with that

 

[craigos]

Guys it’s too late, someone already did it.

So let me get this straight; you make a mediocre (granted, innovative) product and wring your customers out for years, do nothing to address the problems despite the well known issues, continue to charge exorbitant amounts, and offer no further innovation.

Then Garmin comes along and absolutely wipes their ass with the labradar and now you come along and say: “wait hold on we can make that too!”

And then expect people to come running back to buy it after they’ve been penetrated with no lube for years by Labradar? Are we supposed to pretend that they couldn’t have done this earlier if they actually cared?

exactly, incumbent syndrone. they didnt act til someone else did - now welcome to the cost of (re) customer acquisition bitches

 

[Oryx]

The ones that picked up the speed were on "bow" mode and the ones that didn't are on rifle mode. Not defending them, just pointing that out.

It was really just intended as a joke ....

 

[Baron23]

they are clearly trying to appeal to the U.S. market by calling it "Made in North America". It's just a very obvious marketing gimmick to try to trick Americans into thinking it is made in the U.S.

Ah.....the winner of the useless outrage of the day. I was waiting for it.

Yes, even paranoids have enemies. LOL

 

[epeet]

I hope these sell well for LabRadar. But knowing their app is likely to be garbage forever... And the battery life will probably be terrible... And I know own a Garmin...

 

[mikehill85]

Ah.....the winner of the useless outrage of the day. I was waiting for it.

Yes, even paranoids have enemies. LOL

I'm not outraged at all. I was just pointing out their silly marketing gimmick.

 

[Snuby642]

I'm not outraged at all. I was just pointing out their silly marketing gimmick.

Guess some people don't get out much.

If you travel and someone asks you where are you from and you answer America they figure you are ignorant or being a smart ass.

America? North, South what region which country.

Being a company with international sales and describing production in North America is the same as saying we have plants in Europe which may include offices in more than one country.

They probably have sites in The USA to meet military procurement requirements but don't want to be specific.

 

[mikehill85]

Guess some people don't get out much.

If you travel and someone asks you where are you from and you answer America they figure you are ignorant or being a smart ass.

America? North, South what region which country.

Being a company with international sales and describing production in North America is the same as saying we have plants in Europe which may include offices in more than one country.

They probably have sites in The USA to meet military procurement requirements but don't want to be specific.

They are a Canadian company and their production facilities are in Canada.

 

[spife7980]

They are a Canadian company and their production facilities are in Canada.

Im retarded and crossed thread streams

 

[mikehill85]

interesting none the less

Thats MDT, not LabRadar.

 

[Emerson0311]

Turns out I was wrong. It is made in Canada and LabRadar is a Canadian company. In any case, they are clearly trying to appeal to the U.S. market by calling it "Made in North America". It's just a very obvious marketing gimmick to try to trick Americans into thinking it is made in the U.S., otherwise they would just state it is "Made in Canada".

Not necessarily. Quebec businesses may not want to be known as part of Canada. I can’t say where LR stands on this, but this discussion is a thing in Canada. There is a significant group of Quebecers that want to separate from Canada. Many Canadians in the west agree. In the middle of the country live the political ruling class. They play the divide to their own benefit.

 

[Snuby642]

They are a Canadian company and their production facilities are in Canada.

I know they are in Hq in Canada.

I can't belive that you don't understand how the rest of the world views the use of the word America.

It encompasses two continents for starters.

I currently live in the United Sates of America, the state of Texas. Which resides in the North American Continent .

That is how people in the rest of the continents view it.

I would be living in The Republic of Texas on the North American Continent to get rid of a lot of incompetents and dead weight if I had any say in it.

 

[mikehill85]

I know they are in Hq in Canada.

I can't belive that you don't understand how the rest of the world views the use of the word America.

It encompasses two continents for starters.

I currently live in the United Sates of America, the state of Texas. Which resides in the North American Continent .

That is how people in the rest of the continents view it.

I would be living in The Republic of Texas on the North American Continent to get rid of a lot of incompetents and dead weight if I had any say in it.

I also can't believe that you are making this disingenuous argument. Almost any product that has the location where it was manufactured printed on it will list the name of a Country, not the name of a Continent. I also never said it should say, "Made in America" if it were manufactured in the United States of America, which you're using as the basis for this nonsense argument. I would say it should say "Made in The USA" or something similar. That said, there are plenty of advertisements in the United States for all sorts of products which will state they are "Made in America". Just because I am pointing out something that is common practice, doesn't mean I agree with that practice.

Anyway, this conversation is dumb and not really the point of the thread. I just made an observation. If you don't agree, oh well, you don't agree. I just don't see why you and many other people seem to feel the need to immediately hurl ad hominem attacks at people they disagree with. "Guess some people don't get out much.". I apologize to the OP of the post for this nonsense.

 

[37L1]

When I was very young, many, many years ago, I was visiting my relatives in Canada and got in an argument with local "utes" who tried to claim they were "American" because Canada is part of the North American continent. I thought they were stupid then and still do.

I know, cool story, Bro. . .

 

[Snuby642]

I have tried 3 different types of radar units, and observed first hand the dealings with the lab radar and getting it to work indoor range.

I have held in my hands and ran 3 different loads on the Garmin indoor and it took seconds to set up and run, missed zero shots in the strings.

I have had Garmin products for years without problems.

So ya I give them an A rating for a small sample test.

Some punk calls me disingenuous and his contribution was whining about advertising from Garmin.

That company has every right to say made in North America.

Go test a few different units and get back with us.

 

[Evintos]

USB-C at the bottom and no more SD card. Same mobile app. Original unit not discontinued.

 

[Baron23]

Same mobile app.

Eliminates it for me. I have an LR and I dispise their app and its flaky interface with the radar unit.

“Oh, everyone hates our app. Here’s an idea, let’s saddle the brand new product with the same shitty app and ensure we don’t recapture any of our dissatisfied customers”.

FFS

 

[Jefe's Dope]

"By Canadiens for Canadiens".

 

[biggershooter]

Eliminates it for me. I have an LR and I dispose their app and its flaky interface with the radar unit.

From a marketing perspective they should certainly do something. But the upgrade last year has a solid BT connection. It's quite refreshing.

 

[Triple D]

What’s the over/under on Lab Radar still being around in 2 years?

Just based on feedback and threads across multiple sites, it seems like they may have already lost 80% of their market share. It seems the one feature the Lab Radar fans rave about is the ability to measure velocity out to 150yds to generate a BC value. While I don’t think that’s the fastest way to true BC, it appears the new unit can’t even do this.

It’s always good to have competition, but it seems they have slept on customer support and new technology for longer than they can recover from.

 

[b6graham]

What’s the over/under on Lab Radar still being around in 2 years?

Just based on feedback and threads across multiple sites, it seems like they may have already lost 80% of their market share. It seems the one feature the Lab Radar fans rave about is the ability to measure velocity out to 150yds to generate a BC value. While I don’t think that’s the fastest way to true BC, it appears the new unit can’t even do this.

It’s always good to have competition, but it seems they have slept on customer support and new technology for longer than they can recover from.

80% is awfully generous

 

[Snuby642]

Any question on the garmin unit you guys want answered at shot?

I have a friend there right now.

 

[6.5SH]

What’s the over/under on Lab Radar still being around in 2 years?

Just based on feedback and threads across multiple sites, it seems like they may have already lost 80% of their market share. It seems the one feature the Lab Radar fans rave about is the ability to measure velocity out to 150yds to generate a BC value. While I don’t think that’s the fastest way to true BC, it appears the new unit can’t even do this.

It’s always good to have competition, but it seems they have slept on customer support and new technology for longer than they can recover from.

Its greatest strength (output) is also its greatest weakness for many users. The LX and the Garmin are tailored for those who just want muzzle velocity and have limitations where a long range high power beam is not a good thing (short distance to backstop, indoors, baffles etc.)
These were all places where the Magnetospeed was the better tool for the job.

I've had my LabRadar for nearly 10 years, even with the various annoyances it has been the best chronograph I've used and was a real revolutionary leap forward. I will eventually get a Garmin or an LX once I try both as I like the idea of being able to mount it on the rifle for continuous data.
My LabRadar is going nowhere and will still be my primary on the bench.

 

[Baron23]

From a marketing perspective they should certainly do something. But the upgrade last year has a solid BT connection. It's quite refreshing.

Firmware upgrade or app version?

 

[6.5SH]

Firmware upgrade or app version?

Both, was a 9/2023 firmware and a 12/2023 app update

 

[Cole440]

It seems the one feature the Lab Radar fans rave about is the ability to measure velocity out to 150yds to generate a BC value. While I don’t think that’s the fastest way to true BC, it appears the new unit can’t even do this.

Between that and the fact that it’s using the same old busted app, I think they should plan on producing about 10 of these units.

 

[slavex]

as a Canadian and LR owner (and thankfully a Garmin owner too), my experience with LR has been very hit and miss. From downright rude CS to apologies and things getting fixed, and then back to rude and dismissive.
While the LR app does suck, it does offer one thing that I wish the Garmin did AVG PF for a string, hell even being able to see that on the Garmin as you're shooting would be nice, there is room in the GUI for both the app and the Xero itself to show that. Just make it a user selectable option on what you want to see displayed.
I know PF doesn't matter to the long range rifle users much, but to pistol users in USPSA and IPSC it does matter, and that is a huge market to ignore. Every major match in IPSC has at least one Chrono setup to measure competitors ammo, sometimes every competitor, which means those same competitors need their own chrono to know they will be making PF.
Both companies also need to open their product up to synching with Practiscore, other chronos already do, and they are both missing the boat by not.

 

[waveslayer]

I've never owned a lab radar. Used one of my buddys at a range and decided it wasn't worth the investment due to how challenging it was.

I bought a garmin the week of release and it's awesome, after lusting over the aspiration that BulletSeeker/Andiscan represented for more than a year. I belived this would lead to where we are and where we are going, garmin was my entry point.

Look, all the nashing of teeth over labradar's too little/too late - I get it for those burned by Labradar - but this is all on schedule and very good news.

If garmin sits back and doesn't improve their product - then we will have options. And not just what there is currently, there will be several more entries to this space.

This is great for us. Garmin is great. The literal best right now. There are many more things future versions in this space could do. So while I love my garmin, I am not a fanboi. Market offers something better, less expensive, then we will all have options. These will be below 300 before long and be more feature rich. Salad Days.

But the size and money behind Garmin versus the ridiculous Labradar guys is no comparison! Garmin will stay on top, their deep pockets and experience will crush Labradar. Saw their booth at SHOT, I didn't even stop, my Labradar still won't work with the app. I use the Garmin all the time.

 

[waveslayer]

Too lazy to read 5 pages, but here's from the SHOT app I screen shot because someone asked where the info came from.

 

[larryh128]

As I said a few post earlier:

I can confirm, they are made in Trois-Riviere, Quebec, Canada, at the new facility of Infinition. I guess "made in north America" is a marketing affair, for some reason all the Canadian-Made (or at least Quebec-Made) product that I know of have a label of "Made in north America".

I'm surprised that it isn't in French then.

 

[7mm]

I'd buy one of those ugly ass Caldwell Velociraptors before I gave labradar another dime of my money.

Garmin is the leader now.

 

[DocUSMCRetired]

What’s the over/under on Lab Radar still being around in 2 years?

Just based on feedback and threads across multiple sites, it seems like they may have already lost 80% of their market share. It seems the one feature the Lab Radar fans rave about is the ability to measure velocity out to 150yds to generate a BC value. While I don’t think that’s the fastest way to true BC, it appears the new unit can’t even do this.

It’s always good to have competition, but it seems they have slept on customer support and new technology for longer than they can recover from.

Infinition isn't going anywhere anytime soon. They will be around for the next decade easily.

 

[Triple D]

Infinition isn't going anywhere anytime soon. They will be around for the next decade easily.

But will they, or will there be a need to, support the subsidiary Lab Radar…that’s the question.

 

[DocUSMCRetired]

But will they, or will there be a need to, support the subsidiary Lab Radar…that’s the question.

Yes their will be. Just like their will be for many other companies. I see lab radars used quite frequently, almost weekly here. I have already heard buzz and people excited for the new unit. Just as excited as others are for the Garmin.

 

[DocUSMCRetired]

I can share:

1) The LabRadar LX has a beam of 32 degrees.
2) It runs about 6 hours on constant use, and 10 with off/on use.
3) The original will remain in production alongside the LX so both will still be available.
4) The new LX unit does not do long range tracking like the original unit. Think inside 20 yards etc based on bullet size etc etc.
5) No trade in on the old units.
6) Shipping will be around early April.
7) It has been in development for over 18 months now.