All,
I decided to post my new gun recent experience since I could find no information similar to my circumstance. Last month I decided to take advantage of the Remington bolt gun rebates. I have been wanting to puchase a 7 mag for larger game/long range hunting in elk country. I have several 308/260 type caliber bolt guns that serve me well for range and hunting applications. I wanted similar accuracy (1 moa or less; preferably less) in a more powerful cartridge.
So I bought a Remington Sendero SFII in 7 mag. I have seen several of these rifles and read many reviews that they should perform to my expectations. Basically I do not own a bolt gun that will not shoot 1 MOA. I typically do my own basic gun work including stock modification, trigger work/replacement, scope rail bedding, action bedding, etc. All I did to test fire was bed a scope rail, tune the stock trigger and mount a new Burris XTR II 3-15. So with my new gun in hand, I loaded up with the one box of ammo I could find locally; Hornady 139 SST Super performance.
I decided I would do minimal cleaning for the first range seasion. I have always been on the fence about benefits of "barrel break-in". I can see it both ways and I have sometimes cleaned for break-in and sometimes not. I chose not on this rifles. After a bore sight, I got 3 shots on a 8" taeger at 50 yards. Maybe a 3" group. I was not concerend so I moved out to 100 yards to further zero.
Gun shot low and right. I made measured mil adjustments to zero. The gun shot high left. Shoot again, hit high right. Shoot again, low left. Keep in mind this is in the order of 2-6" movements from center. No further adjustments were made and the gun would not repeat. I let the barrel cool, it was not too hot. Shot again with simikar results. Basically after 16 shots the gun only repeated twice and would not hold for a 3 shot group. Ammo? Scope? Barrel heat? Gun? Shooter?
I went home and inspected everything. I could find no real issues. Everything tight, scope tracks, crown is perfect, etc. At this point I clean the barrel. The barrel was filthy and woukd hardly clean out. Patches kept coming black even after poly-brushing. So I cleaned it as much as felt comfortable. I do not like running rods down my barrels unless needed; coated rods. I order some new ammo and waited for delivery.
Back to the range with HSM Berger VLD in 168 and 180 gr, Nosler 168 accubond and Hornady 168 ELDX. Short story is after another 20 rounds or so of various ammos listed, the gun shot one group at about 1.5". The rest were 2-10" and coukd not be called groups.
Range trip 3 with Black Hills ammo 154 and 162 or 168 can't remember. Similar results. No groups. Gun will not repeat. Keep in mind I am shooting other guns at the range out to 600 yards with no issues. It is not a "shooter issue." I even had my buddy shoot it. He could not get groups.
Now I am very concerned and moslty pissed. It is either a scope problem; brand new Burris XTR or a gun problem; brand new Sendero. Both quality and expensive products.
I call Remington to inquire about returning the rifle. I explain everything as stated and say I have not tested the gun with a second optic. The CS guy asked for the serial number and puts me on a brief hold. Comes back to say I need to send in the rifle. I think this is weird since it could be a scope issue and he seemed insistent. I ask if there is a known issue with this lot or production. He says no. I send in the rifle the next Monday.
Remington Service:
Repair Session 1 / Week 2 - Deepen chamber to correct head space, replace bolt - noted non-uniformity; re torque action bolts, recut crown, lap barrel, change trigger. Range report - failed accuracy test.
Repair Session 2 / Week 3 - unknown repair attempt. Range Report - failed accuracy test.
Note: I tested the Burris XTR on a known 0.5 MOA rifle. Shot 4, 5 round groups less than 0.75". One was 0.3". Average was about 1/2".
Repair Session 3 / Week 4 - unknown repair attempt. Range Report - failed accuracy test.
After hearing the attempts and reports from Remington CS I asked to speak with a Supervisor. One called me back the same day. I expressed my concern that this rifle may end up "passing" the accuracy test, but would likely never meet my expectations or represent the average performance of Sendero rifles. He said they would fix it and it will be fine; best guy is now working on it. I explained if it will not shoot less than 1 MOA with quality ammo, I will send it back. I have at least 5 other Remington varmint contour 700's that shoot less than 1". He states they test with Remington Core-lokt and would not state what "passing" accuracy consists of. I further expressed my displeasure and concern that I feel the gun will never meet the level of quality expected of this product. I asked at what point do we consider replacing the barrel, replacing the gun, or offering a refund. He said let them fix it and send it back to me for evaluation. If then it does not perform, I would have to return it again to discuss options. Now I know they understand my concerns and they likely figure simpliy passing is not good enough; maybe/maybe not.
Two days later ai get a call from Remington. "We have determined your rifle cannot be repaired and warrants replacement. Please provide your FFL of choice and we will ship you a new gun." Great News!!!! I did not want a polished turd that is still just shiny shit.
So what the F happened?!! What can be so wrong with this rifle that it will not shoot a group at all with any ammo even when nothing can be found deficient? If they found something, they didnt tell me what it was.
I couldnt find anyone else that had to send a Sendero back for accuracy or have it replaced. A couple threads indicated less than optimum accuracy, but it was unclear if they returned the rifle, accepted the performance, or found anmo that shoots- incomplete stories. These threads were from 2009-2013 timeframe.
So, looks like Remington will try to make it right. Looks like my awesome luck continues as I got a LEMON Sendero which is almost unheard of (by my reasearch). Looks like I am out 4 - 6 weeks of time, 80+ rounds of ammo, and several hours of gun tuning time and range time.
If anyone knows a similar story about the Sendero in magnum calibers, please share. I wonder if 2016 was a bad year or lot. The gun was made June of 2016. Obviously they are not selling/high inventory hence the $150 rebate promotion. My $150 rebate will be used to cover 1/2 the ammo I bought.
Guess only time will tell if the replacement gun meets expectation. I wonder if they will test fire this one before shipping it to me? I doubt it.
I decided to post my new gun recent experience since I could find no information similar to my circumstance. Last month I decided to take advantage of the Remington bolt gun rebates. I have been wanting to puchase a 7 mag for larger game/long range hunting in elk country. I have several 308/260 type caliber bolt guns that serve me well for range and hunting applications. I wanted similar accuracy (1 moa or less; preferably less) in a more powerful cartridge.
So I bought a Remington Sendero SFII in 7 mag. I have seen several of these rifles and read many reviews that they should perform to my expectations. Basically I do not own a bolt gun that will not shoot 1 MOA. I typically do my own basic gun work including stock modification, trigger work/replacement, scope rail bedding, action bedding, etc. All I did to test fire was bed a scope rail, tune the stock trigger and mount a new Burris XTR II 3-15. So with my new gun in hand, I loaded up with the one box of ammo I could find locally; Hornady 139 SST Super performance.
I decided I would do minimal cleaning for the first range seasion. I have always been on the fence about benefits of "barrel break-in". I can see it both ways and I have sometimes cleaned for break-in and sometimes not. I chose not on this rifles. After a bore sight, I got 3 shots on a 8" taeger at 50 yards. Maybe a 3" group. I was not concerend so I moved out to 100 yards to further zero.
Gun shot low and right. I made measured mil adjustments to zero. The gun shot high left. Shoot again, hit high right. Shoot again, low left. Keep in mind this is in the order of 2-6" movements from center. No further adjustments were made and the gun would not repeat. I let the barrel cool, it was not too hot. Shot again with simikar results. Basically after 16 shots the gun only repeated twice and would not hold for a 3 shot group. Ammo? Scope? Barrel heat? Gun? Shooter?
I went home and inspected everything. I could find no real issues. Everything tight, scope tracks, crown is perfect, etc. At this point I clean the barrel. The barrel was filthy and woukd hardly clean out. Patches kept coming black even after poly-brushing. So I cleaned it as much as felt comfortable. I do not like running rods down my barrels unless needed; coated rods. I order some new ammo and waited for delivery.
Back to the range with HSM Berger VLD in 168 and 180 gr, Nosler 168 accubond and Hornady 168 ELDX. Short story is after another 20 rounds or so of various ammos listed, the gun shot one group at about 1.5". The rest were 2-10" and coukd not be called groups.
Range trip 3 with Black Hills ammo 154 and 162 or 168 can't remember. Similar results. No groups. Gun will not repeat. Keep in mind I am shooting other guns at the range out to 600 yards with no issues. It is not a "shooter issue." I even had my buddy shoot it. He could not get groups.
Now I am very concerned and moslty pissed. It is either a scope problem; brand new Burris XTR or a gun problem; brand new Sendero. Both quality and expensive products.
I call Remington to inquire about returning the rifle. I explain everything as stated and say I have not tested the gun with a second optic. The CS guy asked for the serial number and puts me on a brief hold. Comes back to say I need to send in the rifle. I think this is weird since it could be a scope issue and he seemed insistent. I ask if there is a known issue with this lot or production. He says no. I send in the rifle the next Monday.
Remington Service:
Repair Session 1 / Week 2 - Deepen chamber to correct head space, replace bolt - noted non-uniformity; re torque action bolts, recut crown, lap barrel, change trigger. Range report - failed accuracy test.
Repair Session 2 / Week 3 - unknown repair attempt. Range Report - failed accuracy test.
Note: I tested the Burris XTR on a known 0.5 MOA rifle. Shot 4, 5 round groups less than 0.75". One was 0.3". Average was about 1/2".
Repair Session 3 / Week 4 - unknown repair attempt. Range Report - failed accuracy test.
After hearing the attempts and reports from Remington CS I asked to speak with a Supervisor. One called me back the same day. I expressed my concern that this rifle may end up "passing" the accuracy test, but would likely never meet my expectations or represent the average performance of Sendero rifles. He said they would fix it and it will be fine; best guy is now working on it. I explained if it will not shoot less than 1 MOA with quality ammo, I will send it back. I have at least 5 other Remington varmint contour 700's that shoot less than 1". He states they test with Remington Core-lokt and would not state what "passing" accuracy consists of. I further expressed my displeasure and concern that I feel the gun will never meet the level of quality expected of this product. I asked at what point do we consider replacing the barrel, replacing the gun, or offering a refund. He said let them fix it and send it back to me for evaluation. If then it does not perform, I would have to return it again to discuss options. Now I know they understand my concerns and they likely figure simpliy passing is not good enough; maybe/maybe not.
Two days later ai get a call from Remington. "We have determined your rifle cannot be repaired and warrants replacement. Please provide your FFL of choice and we will ship you a new gun." Great News!!!! I did not want a polished turd that is still just shiny shit.
So what the F happened?!! What can be so wrong with this rifle that it will not shoot a group at all with any ammo even when nothing can be found deficient? If they found something, they didnt tell me what it was.
I couldnt find anyone else that had to send a Sendero back for accuracy or have it replaced. A couple threads indicated less than optimum accuracy, but it was unclear if they returned the rifle, accepted the performance, or found anmo that shoots- incomplete stories. These threads were from 2009-2013 timeframe.
So, looks like Remington will try to make it right. Looks like my awesome luck continues as I got a LEMON Sendero which is almost unheard of (by my reasearch). Looks like I am out 4 - 6 weeks of time, 80+ rounds of ammo, and several hours of gun tuning time and range time.
If anyone knows a similar story about the Sendero in magnum calibers, please share. I wonder if 2016 was a bad year or lot. The gun was made June of 2016. Obviously they are not selling/high inventory hence the $150 rebate promotion. My $150 rebate will be used to cover 1/2 the ammo I bought.
Guess only time will tell if the replacement gun meets expectation. I wonder if they will test fire this one before shipping it to me? I doubt it.
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