Shot show 2024
- Thread starter VandelayIndustries
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STOP posting vids of the SAC press. I want one more every time I see it in action. I went and put one of the preorders in the basket last week but just couldn't get myself to click buy. 
Yeah I got burned in 2021 with the whole Nomad Ti weld failure issue but it was eventually fixed and they have been working as intended on several 18” to 20” magnum rifles. It’s also the reason I don’t already own several Nomad LT as they are great performing cans but I did not want to roll the dice on a lemon and get stuck dealing with the roundabout for several months.
That being said metal printing removes the possibility of KGM fucking up the welds again so that already gives me more confidence in the new design.
I REALLY hope, genuinely hope that SAC do not give one to that lady whats-her-name... ultimate shill reloader.
Gordon has plenty of publicity, he doesnt need anyone to push his product...
Gordon has plenty of publicity, he doesnt need anyone to push his product...
Agree but I do like the idea of having the area of the press that holds shell holder being firmly on the bench instead of hanging off like most presses. A buddy got on the pre-order, but as much as I want to I don't know if the features are enough for me to dump my coax. Never say never though I suppose.
It is a very well thought out machine and that in of itself is sometimes motivation enough to buy one, personally speaking.
The only concern I had/have is not being able to size all the way down to the .200 line on the brass, if the die isn't allowed to touch the shell holder.
But, I believe they said their shell holders are .010 lower on the case than industry standard shell holders. So that should alleviate that concern.
But, I believe they said their shell holders are .010 lower on the case than industry standard shell holders. So that should alleviate that concern.
Unfortunately Canadians have to pay for importers and then Canadian retailers for such objects. So there's like 3 middlemen between the consumer and those that make the product.
Ahhh, but metal printing opens a new, fresh, and perhaps worse door…behold:
Barrel damage likelihood from titanium powder?
Looking for some insight. If someone were to “theoretically” fire 13 rounds of .338 lapua through an MRAD barrel that had unknowingly become fouled with a significant amount (think a teaspoon or more, deposited/recirculated throughout the string of fire) of what I’m assuming is titanium powder...
www.snipershide.com
To me, the value seems to be in the W-3 comp chassis. It's feature rich and very affordable, yet no one seems to talk about it.
My understanding is that by making shell holders, he can make them a bit thinner, so the die can go lower. He says you dont have to shave dies.... which is a good. Ive shaved LOTS of sets of 223ai, and a few 300norma dies. All because they couldnt size down enough.
I like the idea of the press. Its a "quality of life" thing. Im not convinced it makes "more accurate" brass. He never even claims that to my knowledge.
Its about making your life easier and more pleasent, i believe we are close to the ceiling of whats possible in a home, non-labatory type deal.. who legit has wind proof tunnels and crazy photography equipment and ... etc...
I like the idea of the press. Its a "quality of life" thing. Im not convinced it makes "more accurate" brass. He never even claims that to my knowledge.
Its about making your life easier and more pleasent, i believe we are close to the ceiling of whats possible in a home, non-labatory type deal.. who legit has wind proof tunnels and crazy photography equipment and ... etc...
Agreed.
With the zero, I mainly run sizing dies that have micrometer tops (419, cortina, etc). So, I run the ram all the way up, and keep pressure on the handle so it doesn't move down slightly. Then I thread the die down until it just barely touches the shell holder. The micrometer top allows me to have full contact with shell holder as well as being able to dial in headspace. Since you don't use the threads to move the headspace.
I just it to have a hard stop, not a cam over. So, basically achieving the same idea as the SAC press. But my way only works with micrometer top dies. The SAC press should work with every type of die.
I was at SAC about a week before SHOT picking up a barreled action they had finished for me. Sitting on the same table was one of the new presses. Of course it caught my eye and I was all over it.
Anyway, Alan gave me lots of info and answered my questions which I had a bunch of. ( I've been reloading for 45 years) It is very solid and well thought out. I believe Inline fabrication is making mounts for it.Yes, there is a hole for primers to come out, so you'll need a mount or drill a hole under it. The different height shell holders eliminate the shaving of dies. Trying to talk myself into buying one.
In the 'bolt action reloading' video I'm pretty sure he mentions screwing the die down to touch the shell holder when sizing.
One of the biggest designs of the press is that you specifically don't touch the shell holder. It has hard stops to prevent this. As well as shell holders that are cut shorter. So you likely won't be able to touch holder if you wanted to and still get correct shoulder set back (unless using a micrometer type).
The pressure he mentions when sizing is from brass inside the die.
From what I've seen pretty blah, but these days with SHOT that's fairly par for the course.
What never ceases to amaze me is how easily consumers are parted from their $$$. Consumers are the single most powerful and at the same time most stupid group on the planet. A perfect example of that is all of these $2000 even $3500+ factory offerings from Savage, Remington, Browning etc. I mean $4100 for a browning A-bolt........ Then again I guess when they see people spending $1000 on a bipod2, $2000 on chassis, $800 on scope mounts, and they probably think offering a whole factory rifle for $2500 is a steal.
The older I get, the harder it is to argue with every dictator's defense that the masses are simply too stupid to make decisions for themselves.
What never ceases to amaze me is how easily consumers are parted from their $$$. Consumers are the single most powerful and at the same time most stupid group on the planet. A perfect example of that is all of these $2000 even $3500+ factory offerings from Savage, Remington, Browning etc. I mean $4100 for a browning A-bolt........ Then again I guess when they see people spending $1000 on a bipod2, $2000 on chassis, $800 on scope mounts, and they probably think offering a whole factory rifle for $2500 is a steal.
The older I get, the harder it is to argue with every dictator's defense that the masses are simply too stupid to make decisions for themselves.
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Maybe I miss understood what he meant by, "the shell holder and the die are not under any pressure, unless you're sizing brass" that's at 0:40. I'm not sure what else he could have meant though.
Means the friction inside the die with brass in it. Which in turn pushes the die and lock ring up until the ring hits the flat above it.
If there was pressure from the die touching the shell holder, it wouldn't matter if you were sizing brass. You'd have pressure regardless.
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You get an extra 10 thousand of sizing on brass with his shell holders. So I don't think there is any concern of not sizing at the .200 line. Like others have said there hopefully won't be any more die cutting or shell holder shaving to achieve more sizing. I've ran into that a lot in my life it sucks so this would be a huge bonus just not to deal with that.
One of the videos not sure where he has a full length die and has rod all the way down and he was able to pull the die out because there is no more die shell holder contact. That is one of the bigger selling points you get perfect camover from press not die and shell holder.
One of the videos not sure where he has a full length die and has rod all the way down and he was able to pull the die out because there is no more die shell holder contact. That is one of the bigger selling points you get perfect camover from press not die and shell holder.
This video illustrates it better. You'll see that he removes the die from the press when it's locked down.
Gotcha, I took it wrong. I was thinking sizing vs. Decapping, mandrel, bullet seating.
Another SHOT item that seems cool is the new Foxtrot Mike AR barrels that are machined from one piece of metal. That's barrel extention, gas block and some kind of keymo mount. Rifling goes as far as it can into the supressor mount.
The cons are that it has a proprietary gas tube and bolt. It also can't be cheap to hog out that much material.
Initially I had issues getting consistent shoulder bumps with my zero press. I set up my dies the way people typically do, run the ram up and screw the die down until it touches the shell holder then go a little past that. During sizing, I noticed the die was no longer contacting the shell holder at the top of the stroke, there was a visible gap. I kept playing with the die until I got consistent contact with the shell holder WHILE sizing, and my shoulder bump issues went away. I’m willing to bet a lot of people aren’t actually getting shell holder contact while sizing. I’ve found that relying on the mechanical stop of the press typically leads to variation in sizing.
In order control the amount of sizing and maintain consistency, people typically use shell holder kits (Redding, Area 419). If you buy these kits for all the shell holders that come with the SAC press, you’re looking at $200+, so that is one justification for the press if it works as advertised. Like others have mentioned, I think SAC really dropped the ball by not making this press work with arbor dies. With their release of the infinity die, it would have made sense, plus it would give people another justification to buy the press if they could sell their arbor press and consolidate some equipment. I still think this press could be used with arbor dies with some pretty simple accessories.
All that said, I like the SAC press concept and will be getting one. Can you get the same results with a Rock Chucker, a standard die, and some shell holder kits? Yes, but I’m so far down this rabbit hole I don’t really care at this point.
In order control the amount of sizing and maintain consistency, people typically use shell holder kits (Redding, Area 419). If you buy these kits for all the shell holders that come with the SAC press, you’re looking at $200+, so that is one justification for the press if it works as advertised. Like others have mentioned, I think SAC really dropped the ball by not making this press work with arbor dies. With their release of the infinity die, it would have made sense, plus it would give people another justification to buy the press if they could sell their arbor press and consolidate some equipment. I still think this press could be used with arbor dies with some pretty simple accessories.
All that said, I like the SAC press concept and will be getting one. Can you get the same results with a Rock Chucker, a standard die, and some shell holder kits? Yes, but I’m so far down this rabbit hole I don’t really care at this point.
I hate to say it but I really like the looks of this press. I currently run a MEC to size than prepped brass gets run through a Dillon 550. I have originally been looking into a Zero but honestly this is more my style and bonus its a little cheaper.
Based on my experience with SAC I believe that this will be on par with the Zero as far as machining and build quality so really it only comes down to turret vs single stage. IMO the turret just adds complexity and cost while I'm pretty sure I could load die just as fast in either. I also like what SAC is doing with the hard stop w/o die contact. We've all ground dies and shell holders and it's a PIA.
I actually like it....of course, I'm a guy (idiot? haha) that spent $2k for a Spolar Shotshell Reloader...that's now listed for $5,100!!
Not sure "accurate" is the right term....I believe that his position is that with the cam over being built into the press, you get more "consistent" sizing.
****EOtech OGL news.****
I spoke to some of the guys at EOtech, and they let me know that they have absolutely no intention of releasing a Civ model of the OGL this year, and that it's not even on the forefront of their properties right now.
Something about how the FP version was the priory and is taking up plenty of their resources keeping up with demand and product support for that one.
This was right after John Lovell's wife chased him away from me at the DD booth next door. Honestly just wanted a pic with her, but they were on a mission and I was just another annoying fan in her eyes. lol
Lose, lose.
I spoke to some of the guys at EOtech, and they let me know that they have absolutely no intention of releasing a Civ model of the OGL this year, and that it's not even on the forefront of their properties right now.
Something about how the FP version was the priory and is taking up plenty of their resources keeping up with demand and product support for that one.
This was right after John Lovell's wife chased him away from me at the DD booth next door. Honestly just wanted a pic with her, but they were on a mission and I was just another annoying fan in her eyes. lol
Lose, lose.
I know it gets lost in the weeds but back on my post 650 I mentioned a friend and I discussing if someone were to make a turret for the zero that had the cutout for dies like the coax and sac press to just make die switching monumentally easier. That would be a pretty dope thing to see.
I like the sac press though...the more I think on it the more I sorta want one
Yea pretty much. I think it'd be pretty neat and a solid money maker
Seeing all the folks with hardons for a single stage press
Who knew folks still want to load 40-50 rounds per Hour for, marginally better ammo, must be all the retired folk on the site.
Who knew folks still want to load 40-50 rounds per Hour for, marginally better ammo, must be all the retired folk on the site.
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Everyone has there own system and not everyone is competing every month ect. The way I do things I don't mind the single stage and in my opinion less things at once going on. Now if I was super rich I would be running what f-class John does but not in the cards haha
A good amount of people on this site shoot in some sort of discipline or multiple (PRS, F Class, BR, etc). Where you have $5k rifles, $4k optics and it costs $2 to pull the trigger. Travel, entry fees.....etc.
If we were all being logical about this, none of us would own or do any of that.
I promise you that we could look at your setup, or things you do in life and find hilarious waste of money. Do you make every meal or cup of coffee at home? If not, huge waste of money.
Just posting in this thread shows a huge waste of time. You could be doing something else more productive with your time.
TLDR: glass houses and such
Like I already posted, the best ammo I’ve ever loaded was on a Dillon with floating tool heads. It doesn’t get any straighter than no detectable runout or OAL variation.
These uber supreme single stages are a huge fucking gimmick that plenty of people are apparently willing to bust out their wallets and blow a lot of money for because they think it’ll make them shoot better.
These uber supreme single stages are a huge fucking gimmick that plenty of people are apparently willing to bust out their wallets and blow a lot of money for because they think it’ll make them shoot better.
What I like the most about your posts is the autistic screeching while you waffle between "stop being rich" and "stop being poor". You truly are special.
Most would probably call it being logical or reasonable but when things are seen from the perspective of a retard I suppose I can understand how that could be evaluated differently.
Not that I’ve seen. Looks like they hinted at some new BLRF’s with a teaser pic but haven’t released them.
Building on this thread.
www.snipershide.com
Sidearms & Scatterguns - More 1911 fuddery
Does anyone care about what the 1911 fudds say or do? They seem to forget that there are many other designs without all the weaknesses of a "finely tuned" 1911. Yes I know who the guy in the video is. No I don't care about his advice. It's either dated or specific to only one type of pistol.
www.snipershide.com
Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but why don't you just roll size your brass, if the base isn't getting sized enough?
<chuckle> Hey, I'm about to retire! LOL! I guess, for some, that's their deal. Personally, I opted the Autodrive route on a 750 and CP2000. I'm too old, and too lazy to sit there and pull the handle. Besides, the autodrive seems to impart better consistency, since there's no human in the loop.
40-50 rds per hour is a hard "no" in my book this days, unless I absolutely have to go that route.
Where could one find some good complete truthful information on a complete Dillon setup for precision rifle, like 6BR / 6.5Creed in my case?
Didn’t run into this here on the hide, especially by the ones calling single stage press users retards.
Isn’t a setup like this running 4-5k incl auto drive?
That’s my reasoning for not having looked into it to much. Thanks
Didn’t run into this here on the hide, especially by the ones calling single stage press users retards.
Isn’t a setup like this running 4-5k incl auto drive?
That’s my reasoning for not having looked into it to much. Thanks
I know this is directed at me and I didn’t call anyone a retard for using a single stage, so maybe read that again.
When I bought my setup Dillon 650’s were like $600, no idea what they are now and then ideally you need two floating tool heads per caliber. One for sizer and expander mandrel in first run before prep and then another for dropping powder with the funnel setup and seating bullets.
I never used the auto drive on it and it wouldn’t have worked for the procedure I used anyway except for the first process since I was doing charges on an auto throw and dropping them down an area 419 funnel adaptor. I just used the case feeder and it was fast as shit that way.
First question: I'd argue precision loading (as in powder charging and bullet seating) on a Dillon isn't optimal for uber precise ammo, though with some of the newer ball powders I may be mistaken.
Second question: Yeah, easily $4-5k. But it's the time and consistency when doing the labor intensive part of precision reloading, that leverages the benefits of a Dillon and AD. Getting the depriming, sizing, trimming and neck expanding done with a Dillon/AD combo is a huge time savings, and as mentioned earlier, since it's being done by a machine, the consistency of dwell time in the die and force used, make the cases incredibly consistent.
Essentially, I started out just looking to load 223 and 9mm bulk ammo for training/practice. But once I had everything set up, I began to realize that the real benefit was consistency of the brass being processed (and brass prep being the most time consuming part of making precision ammo).
JMTCW...
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