.308 Winchester

[Mike_in_FL]

Hmmm??? Something doesn't sound quite right.

First, 45 grs of Varget is well of max pressure (like around 66,650 psi)

I just copied this from Dan Newberry's optimal charge weight website. It's for use in Winchester brass and should be reduced by 4% for other brass

.308 Winchester using Varget
155 grain bullet, 47.8 grains
168 grain bullet, 46.0 grains
175 grain bullet, 45.0 grains (an all around favorite)

Personally what works in my old 700 with 24" varmint barrel is 42.5 Varget in Lapua right at 2.800, even though it's jumping something like .130 in my rifle.

 

[straightshooter1]

I just copied this from Dan Newberry's optimal charge weight website. It's for use in Winchester brass and should be reduced by 4% for other brass

.308 Winchester using Varget
155 grain bullet, 47.8 grains
168 grain bullet, 46.0 grains
175 grain bullet, 45.0 grains (an all around favorite)

Personally what works in my old 700 with 24" varmint barrel is 42.5 Varget in Lapua right at 2.800, even though it's jumping something like .130 in my rifle.

The larger volume of the Winchester brass helps a lot and the 45 gr of Varget is then just a hair below SAAMI max pressure (or so). So, one could probably even push with a little more. But still, with a 20" barrel you'd be lucky to get a little more than 2650 fps. And if you load them long, that'll help handle a little more powder.

 

[Heffo]

Yep similar to above results. I run the Berger 175 Otm’s out of a 16 inch barrel. Have found two loads, one at 43.5gr (2520fps) and another at 44.8grs (2600fps). That’s with Lapua brass, 2208, CCI BR2s.

 

[AllWorkAndNoPlay]

Sorry, that was a typo my barrel is 24”...here’s a pic of my rig and the target.

 

[Deleted member 113831]

45 grains of Varget in Lapua brass behind a 175 is really hot. I'm gonna guess between 65k and 70k psi.

My 24" Bartlein runs 175's at 2630 fps out of LC brass w/43.5 of Varget, or 41.5 of IMR4895.

 

[ubettcha]

My 26" rock cannot run 45 grains of varget. I can run cfe223 and the 195tmk at 2700fps. Varget will push the 168 berger 2840 but that is for hunting in the fall, not repeated target shooting. I get a mark if the round sits in a hot chamber and that is still less than 45 grains in lrp lapua brass.
My barrel runs fgmm 175smk's at 2704 for slow lots and 2745 for the faster lots for reference.

 

[Krob95]

I’ll be running 44.4gr of varget behind a 175vld. Lapua LRP brass. CCI 200’s. 2580fps. 16.5” proof carbon barrel. Doing a jump test today to see if I can shrink groups.

 

[MC56]

Hmmm??? Something doesn't sound quite right.

First, 45 grs of Varget is well over max pressure (like around 66,650 psi)

Then, this 45 grs of Varget pushing a 175 SMK out of a 20" barrel is not likely to get to 2700 fps let alone 2800 . . .??? Now, if it were a 26" barrel, then that MV would be just right . . . according to all my own data I've collected along with what QuickLoad calculates.

I wouldn't recommend this load unless one is well experience AND works slowly up to it watching for pressure signs.

I agree the velocity seems high but 45gr behind a 175 is max load for Varget per Hodgon. I'm still doing load development but so far I've loaded up to 44.2gr without pressure signs.

 

[Krob95]

I agree the velocity seems high but 45gr behind a 175 is max load for Varget per Hodgon. I'm still doing load development but so far I've loaded up to 44.2gr without pressure signs.

I ran up to 44.7 with no pressure signs. I have crunchy loads though at 44.4grs with 60 and 80 thou off the lands in my rifle. Hoping it will be alright for a few rounds. May end up backing off the powder in order to seat deeper without getting compressed rounds.

Lapua brass
CCI 200’s
44.4gr varget


Edit:

Shot the jump test loads today. 20 and 40 thou off sucked ass. The compressed loads at 60 and 80 thou off were much better grouping. First pic is info at 60 off. Second pic is 80 off. All virgin brass with no adjustment to neck tension or anything.

 

[Baddog 0302]

The larger volume of the Winchester brass helps a lot and the 45 gr of Varget is then just a hair below SAAMI max pressure (or so). So, one could probably even push with a little more. But still, with a 20" barrel you'd be lucky to get a little more than 2650 fps. And if you load them long, that'll help handle a little more powder.

Is there any list that shows the volume of the different brands of brass ? Lapua, FGMM, Winchester, Winchester Match, Black Hills Match, LC LR, LC, and any others .

 

[straightshooter1]

Is there any list that shows the volume of the different brands of brass ? Lapua, FGMM, Winchester, Winchester Match, Black Hills Match, LC LR, LC, and any others .

I'm not aware of any such list other than my own that I've put together over time. I keep it on a spreadsheet with my own load history and other loading information, see here (but be aware of difference between volume of a sized vs fired brass):

 

[Heffo]

Settled on load today with 175 Berger otm. 16 inch barrel. 44.8gr ADI2208 (varget). Lapua brass. BR4s 2600fps. ES 9 SD 4. Just over .5 inch at 200 metres. Loaded 2.245” CBTO (30thou jump). Cheers.

 

[Baddog 0302]

straightshooter1
THANK YOU, I've been told that the BHA brass is made by Winchester, and I have some BHA & Winchester Match brass so I'll compare both for vol.

 

[Krob95]

Set neck tension on the last 50 pieces of virgin brass as it seems lapua brass has some pretty tight necks from the factory and loaded up my different nodes on both sides to see how wide or narrow it is. All compressed at 80k off except 42gr. Gonna give it a go tomorrow probably to see how it looks on paper and radar. Also shout out to lapua for the free extra piece of brass!

 

[LAW-DOG]

Has anyone seen the prices of varget & H4895 on gunbroker lately. 1lb bottles are selling for $125 & 8lb jugs are $1000. It’s hard to believe that there are people willing to pay this. There seems to be a lot of willing people because it’s selling fast even at these outrageous prices. Go on gunbroker & type varget or H4895 on the search

 

[Mooseknuckles]

That is unbelievable how much that powder is going for. I guess I’m sitting on a gold mine having 20 pounds of it.

 

[LAW-DOG]

It’s the same thing with cci br2/4, 450, federal 205M/210M. 1000 ct box for $200-400 & 5000 ct box for $1300-2000. $2000 was the highest bid that I saw for a 5000 ct box of primers. I still can’t believe people are paying this much.

 

[MC56]

175 SMK over 44.3gr Varget .020 off the lands.
Avg 2755 fps
SD 6
ES 16

Shot from a Tikka T3X w/ 26", 10tw, Solid Accuracy Criterion prefit.

 

[earthquake]

Is there a separate forum thread for .308 subs? If not, looking for decent loads. I've heard Trail Boss is a good powder, but I'm more interested bullets and bullet weights for good sub loads. So far I've only messed with factory boxed stuff at 175 & 220 gr. The 175's seemed to shoot a bit better for me, but it's statistically insignificant right now. Thanks

 

[LAW-DOG]

Anybody want to trade BR2 or fed 205M for H4895. I need BR2 & fed 205M primers

 

[ceruleanblue]

A fairly accurate load:
Bullet: Sierra 168 grain HPBT stock#2200
Stability Factor: 3.84
Bullet diameter: 0.307" measured
Bullet Length: 1.210"
Ballistic coefficient:0.218
Drag Model: G7
Neck Bushing used: .355"
Powder: BLC-2
Powder weight: 43.2 grains (fills case well)
chronographed speed: 2819 fps
OAL : magazine fitting 2.768"
Barrel: 660 mm, 1:10 R twist
Case: 308 Win FC
Primer: Federal Large Rifle
Rifle: Stock CZ 557 Varmint

 

[chrisg4607]

Hmmm??? Something doesn't sound quite right.

First, 45 grs of Varget is well over max pressure (like around 66,650 psi)

Then, this 45 grs of Varget pushing a 175 SMK out of a 20" barrel is not likely to get to 2700 fps let alone 2800 . . .??? Now, if it were a 26" barrel, then that MV would be just right . . . according to all my own data I've collected along with what QuickLoad calculates.

I wouldn't recommend this load unless one is well experience AND works slowly up to it watching for pressure signs.

I'm shooting an HS Precision 308 26" barrel 1/12 twist
Lapua brass
CCI #200 primers
44.5gr IMR4064
Sierra MK 175
and my average is 2730 fps
GMM #210 primers produce 10 ft per sec slower MV
and 45.5gr of IMR4064 I start getting extractor marks when temp is 75 deg or above. So I leave it backed off to 44.5gr and don't get pressure signs at any temp I have checked the loads at.

 

[LAW-DOG]

43-43.5g of varget with the Berger 180gr Elite Hybrid is very good & maybe the best for a 1:11 twist barrel. This bullet is very jump tolerable & has a high .576 bc. 2615 FPS in rock creek 24in 5r 43.5g varget. 3.08in to my lands & I’ve loaded 2.95-3.06 & they all shoot sub .5moa. My throat was built for 168 & 178 eldm to be loaded around 2.92in. CFE 223 is another powder that has done well for me in almost every 223 & 308 bullets I’ve tried. 45.1g CFE 223, 180gr elite hybrid Berger, 2.95in long jump .120in, sub .5moa, 2650 FPS in 24in rock 5r 1:11. 46.1g CFE, 168 ELDM, 2.915 .010 off the lands, sub .5moa, 2680 FPS in 40-50° but 2750 FPS in 70-85° weather

 

[Baddog 0302]

Starting to load test loads for a Tikka TAC A1, I find that I can load 168's and 175/178's to an OAL of 2.93" (+-) and they function through the Mag.
For Tikka owners, have you found loading to the longer OAL offers better accuracy that the 2.8" (+) OAL that functions through 308 AR Mags ??

Thank you

 

[blbennett1288]

I am wanting to conserve my Varget cache for 6mm. I have not given up trying to find powder online, but I think it’ll be easier to pick up powder in my LGS. They have a good stock and selection, but it’s kinda random. So i am trying to collect a list of viable .308 powders, so i am not googling in the store. I have gone through this thread and the AR only .308 Win thread. What other powders would you run in a .308?


Reloader15
IMR 4064
IMR 4166
IMR 4895
Ramshot Tac
BLC-2
VV N550
VV 150
Shooters World Precision
Shooters World Long Rifle
AR Comp
CFE223
8208XBR
H4895
H380
H322
H355
Benchmark

 

[Kevins750]

I have used AA2230 with lighter bullets and AA2520, Norma 203b and imr 4320 with 168gr. My main powders for 308 are varget and imr 4064 with 175 gr matchburner and matchkings.

 

[Nostrings]

i Like vv 140 and 540 on 168 and 175 , n135 did really well with 155 nosler custom comps.

 

[blbennett1288]

I have used AA2230 with lighter bullets and AA2520, Norma 203b and imr 4320 with 168gr. My main powders for 308 are varget and imr 4064 with 175 gr matchburner and matchkings.

I have found a stockpile of IMR4320. Any experience with IMR3031?

 

[Kevins750]

I have found a stockpile of IMR4320. Any experience with IMR3031?

I don't have any experience with 3031. But I think the M1 guys use it quite a bit.

 

[StrayDog]

2000MR with a 175, 178, or 185.

 

[JabariHunt]

Is anyone loading .308 specifically for short barrels (~12.5 in) Yes, I know that's not a practical barrel length for .308. It is however a lot of fun. Just seeing if anyone else is paring that with their reloading habit.

 

[straightshooter1]

Is anyone loading .308 specifically for short barrels (~12.5 in) Yes, I know that's not a practical barrel length for .308. It is however a lot of fun. Just seeing if anyone else is paring that with their reloading habit.

You mean barrels like this?

And maybe this might give you some idea what you might load to:

168 gr A‑MAX® TAP PRECISION® - Hornady Law Enforcement

...

www.hornadyle.com

 

[Phil McGrath]

I have found a stockpile of IMR4320. Any experience with IMR3031?

Way, way back in the stone age the original Federal Match load for .308 used a 168SMK under 39.5grs of IMR-3031 in there case.

I don't have any experience with 3031. But I think the M1a guys use it quite a bit.

Fixed it for you.

 

[Nbleak21]

Is anyone loading .308 specifically for short barrels (~12.5 in) Yes, I know that's not a practical barrel length for .308. It is however a lot of fun. Just seeing if anyone else is paring that with their reloading habit.

I am about to start working up a load for a 12.5” 308 AR Pistol.

 

[Bcorley50]

Does anyone have a load worked up using ADG brass?

 

[5RWill]

For the reference of varget i ran 45.2gr compressed with 178gr BTHP out of my 20" 5R at 2630fps for years before i sold it. It's up there in pressure but i never had huge pressure signs. Both with Nosler and Lapua brass.

Really regretting selling that barreled action now as i'm really wanting an XM3 or modern day XM3 and want to do it on a 700. Probably go 16.5" since the surefire FA762 and corresponding brake are hard to find, hella expensive, and weighty.

Speaking of loading though has anyone seen the 169gr SMK? .527G1 above 2180 and .505 between 1540 and 2180. Outstanding honestly. If it's anything like the design of the new 130gr SMK they're going to be great. That 130 might be the most accurate bullet with the widest nodes i've ever ran through my 6.5x47.

.30 CALIBER/7.62MM 169 GR. HPBT MATCH - Sierra Bullets

This bullet was designed with one thing in mind, and that was to shoot 1000 yards in a 308 Winchester. To accomplish that, we added length to the boattail and engineered a forgiving tangent ogive with a closed nose. Doing this gave it a .527 BC which keeps it super sonic past 1000 yards in a 308...

www.sierrabullets.com

Yep similar to above results. I run the Berger 175 Otm’s out of a 16 inch barrel. Have found two loads, one at 43.5gr (2520fps) and another at 44.8grs (2600fps). That’s with Lapua brass, 2208, CCI BR2s

Heffo is that a tight bore?

 

[FuhQ]

I am about to start working up a load for a 12.5” 308 AR Pistol.

There is a .308 Win subsection just for AR's... Might start there. Probably be more helpful.

 

[Buck300]

Case full of Varget and 168's are hard to beat in the 308 win.

 

[FuhQ]

Case full of Varget and 168's are hard to beat in the 308 win.

Lapua case full of Varget and Berger 215 Hybrids for me.

 

[JH1961]

I've had EXCELLENT results with IMR3031 in .308.

 

[JH1961]

45 grains of Varget in Lapua brass behind a 175 is really hot. I'm gonna guess between 65k and 70k psi.

My 24" Bartlein runs 175's at 2630 fps out of LC brass w/43.5 of Varget, or 41.5 of IMR4895.

I thought ammo pressures were measured in c.u.p.s (copper units of pressure)? I don't recall how, exactly, the two units differ.

 

[straightshooter1]

I thought ammo pressures were measured in c.u.p.s (copper units of pressure)? I don't recall how, exactly, the two units differ.

Perhaps this will answer your question satisfactorily:

CUP vs. PSI — What’s The Difference in Pressure Measurements « Daily Bulletin

by Philip Mahin, Sierra Bullets Ballistic Technician This article first appeared in the Sierra Bullets Blog The ANSI / SAAMI group, short for American National Standard Institute and Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers’ Institute, have made available some time back the voluntary industry...

bulletin.accurateshooter.com

 

[JH1961]

Perhaps this will answer your question satisfactorily:

CUP vs. PSI — What’s The Difference in Pressure Measurements « Daily Bulletin

by Philip Mahin, Sierra Bullets Ballistic Technician This article first appeared in the Sierra Bullets Blog The ANSI / SAAMI group, short for American National Standard Institute and Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers’ Institute, have made available some time back the voluntary industry...

bulletin.accurateshooter.com

Thank you, Sir!

 

[Sev308]

I was wondering if anyone has any data for the Savage Axis Precision II (in 308 win). It's a relatively new rifle and I haven't seen many people sharing data for it. I haven't been able to come up with a decent load yet and was wondering if anyone has some data on it. I tried some CFE223 and BL(C)-2 as that's the only two powders I can find right now.

 

[FuhQ]

I was wondering if anyone has any data for the Savage Axis Precision II (in 308 win). It's a relatively new rifle and I haven't seen many people sharing data for it. I haven't been able to come up with a decent load yet and was wondering if anyone has some data on it. I tried some CFE223 and BL(C)-2 as that's the only two powders I can find right now.

Every rifle is going to be different, even if they were built exactly the same, at the same time, one after the other on the assembly line. You will need to work up a load for your individual rifles.

I recommend Varget if you can find some. I've had good luck with Varget, CFE-223, and LeverEvolution.

 

[Sev308]

Every rifle is going to be different, even if they were built exactly the same, at the same time, one after the other on the assembly line. You will need to work up a load for your individual rifles.

I recommend Varget if you can find some. I've had good luck with Varget, CFE-223, and LeverEvolution.

I agree with you completely, but if I can find data using the same rifle, there is a high chance with little tweaks it should shoot similarly. Also Varget is impossible to find where I live. And the other powders I currently have are all ball powders and I was at the range today for example at -30 C temperatures (-22F) and I feel like it's not shooting as accurately as it should. But again, i'm sure there is many reasons for it. I just wanted to know if anyone with the same rifle had any luck with it so I could maybe give it a try with the limited supplies there is.

 

[LAW-DOG]

I agree with you completely, but if I can find data using the same rifle, there is a high chance with little tweaks it should shoot similarly. Also Varget is impossible to find where I live. And the other powders I currently have are all ball powders and I was at the range today for example at -30 C temperatures (-22F) and I feel like it's not shooting as accurately as it should. But again, i'm sure there is many reasons for it. I just wanted to know if anyone with the same rifle had any luck with it so I could maybe give it a try with the limited supplies there is.

I run cfe 46.1gr 168 eldm at 2750 fps 1/11 twist 24in rock barrel. In winter my velocity drops to 2685 fps but accuracy is not affected. If you are not running it warm it might drop the pressure low enough to effect the accuracy. Below 45.5g accuracy was worse & above 46.5g it was worse but not as bad as lower charges with cfe. I think cfe might work better at slightly higher pressures. Have you tried adjusting your loads higher with the ball powders to compensate for the lower temps?

 

[jLorenzo]

Any advice on doing load development with limited components? With the price and availability being so crazy these days I want to make good use of what I have.

 

[FuhQ]

Any advice on doing load development with limited components? With the price and availability being so crazy these days I want to make good use of what I have.

You might need to be just a TAD bit more specific... You know, we don't know what components YOU have on-hand, if you don't tell us...

 

[JMGlasgow]

Any known loads using SW Precision Rifle powder and 155.5 Berger and 175gr SMK?

25" 1-12 twist barrel