(CLOSED!) **ROUND2 !!** (100YARD) , Bolt-Action, 6group, 30round SHOOTOUT!

[elfster1234]

got ya on the boards diego-ted!

Hide name- Diego-ted
Date of shoot: 12/15/03

Was on the Hide this morning and read about this challenge. Since I was getting ready to retire the factory tube after 1500 rounds, I decided to load up some ammo and give this challenge a go. Rifle is a factor Savage F/tr in 308 that has been worked over by Larry Racine. He pillar bedded the action, trued the bolt face, did a little trigger work and diamond lapped the tube.
Load is as follows:
Twice fired Lapua brass that was full sized and NOT fire formed. (my buddy gave me this brass, which he just shot out of his GAP crusader.)
168 Amax set 20k off the lands
43.5 gr of Varget
FGMM primers.
The rifle was cleaned so I fired 15 rounds to foul the barrel. Then groups were shot consecutively in 30 minutes using a Sinclair Gen 2 bipod and an Protektor rear bag from a bench.
Group size was measured per the rules zeroing the calipers on a 168 gr Amax.
Groups were
.575,.599,.900,.403,1.200,.655=4.332
Average group size is .722
Smallest group is .403.

 

[elfster1234]

about 10-15 seconds between shots, & about 3-5 min between groups.

the key is to NOT move your scope view / cheek weld during your shots... once you start your group shots = don't move head / scope position.

How long are yall waiting between shots and between groups? Prior to this range outing I hadn't shot a whole lot of 5 shot groups in succession and my results were less than stellar. Still averaging about an inchish group barring some flyers that were mainly my fault but this rifle used to shoot in the .2s for 3 shot groups. I know, I know, 3 shot groups suck. I changed lots of varget, used some once fired brass from another gun, didn't check brass length(some were hard to chamber with FL sizing), some primers didn't seat good, got the barrel threaded since the last time I shot, put a new scope on it, basically changed everything. I noticed the gun was getting really hot after 10 shots or so taking a shot every 10-15 seconds and about 45 seconds between the two groups. This is on a stockish 308 5R Remington. Going to process some brass I know shot well, and do my brass prep right(not rush) this time.

Dots are 1/2", ignore the bottom shots those were from zeroing the rifle and testing POI shift with the can. First group I pulled first shot left, 3rd group on the second row the flyer to right was when the guy next to me with a 50cal shot right as I was shooting. Cant decide if its just my terrible shooting or if something is messed up with all that Ive changed. Vertical dispersion on group 5 was probably due to neck tension as I noticed those were real stiff to chamber, the horizontal dispersion leads me to believe its just my shooting. I left my triad stock pack on another rifle so cheek weld wasn't as good as normal either. Unfortunately I didn't have the magnetospeed on for these groups, I shot 30 rounds from my old batch of loads and the SD was 13 for a 10 shot string running 178amaxs over 44gr of varget at 2670avg out of the 24" pipe so I know my old loads were good. Basically a lot of stuff I need to check/improve on. Six five shots groups is definitely grueling and requires patience, something Im still trying to learn after almost 30 years on this earth

 

[MoBoost]

Are F-class style bipods OK for this?

 

[elfster1234]

Bipod needs to be mounted to the rifle and can not be adjustable in terms of elevation. If you can pick up the rifle & walk with it with the bipod still mounted = then you're OK.

Are F-class style bipods OK for this?

 

[elfster1234]

bumpage

 

[MoBoost]

Picked this rifle up yesterday.
Remington 700 SPS Tactical .308.
Burris 6.5-20x44 Tactical

Trigger out of the box was 4.5lbs, the little "external adjustment" didn't do anything, but quick youtube search showed how to properly adjust it. I've set mine right under 3lbs.

35 rounds down the pipe - 5 to get on paper, 30 for the groups

43.0 Varget 168 SMK

.6315" average
.281" best

 

[elfster1234]

Thats awesome moboost! Looks like a kick ass rifle purchase for the money! Ill get ya on the boards when i can get back on my pc.... Hard to update the boards with my ipad.

Picked this rifle up yesterday.
Remington 700 SPS Tactical .308.
Burris 6.5-20x44 Tactical

Trigger out of the box was 4.5lbs, the little "external adjustment" didn't do anything, but quick youtube search showed how to properly adjust it. I've set mine right under 3lbs.

35 rounds down the pipe - 5 to get on paper, 30 for the groups

43.0 Varget 168 SMK

.6315" average
.281" best

 

[Coloradocop]

EDITED:

I was originally posting to ask how to measure my groups with analog calipers... I later found the following post from the OP, so I'm editing my post to reflect the information already provided on this thread (I use dial calipers that can't be zeroed to the bullet, so I've always done my groups by measuring extreme spread, minus the bullet's diameter):

sounds good... I trust you. Your calipers should be able to zero out correct? If they do zero out, then zero out on the bullet used and measure outside to outside. If not, then yes.... measure outside to outside and subtract the bullet diameter as the groups in this thread will get stupid small. I just want to make sure this is fair to everyone else spending such time & money.

Nice shooting! Looking good!

Anyway, this looks like a fun little contest... I'll have to try it next time I'm at the range!

 

[elfster1234]

you can either zero your calipers on the bullet used and measure outside to outside (easiest way of doing it with less math & the way I do it)...

or measure outside to outside and deduct the diameter of the bullet...

either is fine and will measure to the middle of the bullet hole of the two furthest bullet holes

as per the OP: Please zero out calipers on the bullet used and measure outside to outside of bullet holes!!

I'm thinking of going out to the range to try this for fun next week, but I do have a question:

Am I correctly understanding that you are wanting outside-to-outside measurements without a subtraction included for bullet diameter? It seems that this measuring style would penalize anyone shooting with a larger bore rifle when compared to someone who is shooting a smaller bore rifle. By way of example: if someone is shooting with a .50cal, the theoretical minimum possible diameter group they could ever shoot (when measuring outside-to-outside without a bullet diameter adjustment) would be 0.5". Conversely, a person shooting a .223cal rifle could shoot a group that is theoretically as small as .223" (okay, .224 bullet diameter, but I imagine you get what I'm saying). Obviously no one will shoot at the limit of what is theoretically possible, but all else being equal the person with the larger bore diameter will produce a group that falls lower in the rankings.

I know it's really just a fun shoot, but I was wondering if there was a reason it was decided that the shoot should be done in this manner, rather than taking the bullet diameter and subtracting it from the extreme spread of the group (for a true center-to-center group size measurement)?

Or, perhaps I misunderstood the instructions (after all, I am but a government employee...)


NOTE: I do see how at least one user zeroed their digital calipers to reflect a "-.308" for the bore diameter of a .30cal. Obviously that accomplishes the same thing I just talked about, but I'm not really sure how a person can do that with a dial caliper?

 

[Coloradocop]

Thanks for the quick reply... after I posted my question I re-read the entire thread and found the later post where you mentioned using dial/analog calipers in this contest. So, it all makes sense now, and I've adjusted my post to highlight that information you provided (in case there are other old-school folks like me who haven't quite adapted to the digital age).


Now I just gotta get out to the range and prove up with my 1/4" groups all day long


P.S: don't hold your breath on that one!

 

[elfster1234]

you're on the boards once again moboost! good work my friend. #1 for best single also!

 

[wander]

savage, criterion 6mmBR barrel.
load...6mmbr Lapua brass, 29.2 gr Varget, 105 VLD, CCI450.
best group .303"
AVE group .423
http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x403/wander6mmbr/IMG_20131201_135444_075.jpg
http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x403/wander6mmbr/IMG95201311289511173795922.jpg
http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x403/wander6mmbr/IMG_20131201_135321_081.jpg
http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x403/wander6mmbr/savage6br.jpg

 

[wander]

 

[wander]

 

[jelrod1]

Can I still enter this?

 

[MoBoost]

Wander: man, that's one consistent rifle. Good job.

jelrod1: yes, this is happening

 

[jelrod1]

6mmBR build by Jon Beanland 10 twist Krieger.
30.6 IMR8208 XBR, 90 Berger BT at jam-.005

Best .199
Average .2956
Shot 1/1/14

 

[John1911.com]

6mmBR build by Jon Beanland 10 twist Krieger.
30.6 IMR8208 XBR, 90 Berger BT at jam-.005

Best .199
Average .2956
Shot 1/1/14

Damn. That is VERY consistent. Much better than I can do.

I think your average is better than my personal all-time best single group.

TTR

 

[MoBoost]

Marlin XS7 redux:
Changes: action pillar bedded to stock, brass is fireformed (instead of fireforming)

Rifle:
Action: Marlin XS7
Barrel: Brux 1:8; Remington 6mm Remington take-off; shortened, threaded for Savage and chambered by Mechanical Accuracy.
Stock: Boyds, pillar bedded
Glass: Sightron Big Sky 6.5-20x50

Weather:
52F dropping to 15F (with windshield) in 1hour, wind 7mph going to 22MPH ... shivering is not helping.

Load:
Lapua brass, 33.0 Varget, 95 Berger VLD hunting, 2925FPS

Group:
Average: .440
Smallest: .197
Longest distance POA to POI: .408

 

[MoBoost]

6mmBR build by Jon Beanland 10 twist Krieger.
30.6 IMR8208 XBR, 90 Berger BT at jam-.005

Best .199
Average .2956
Shot 1/1/14

Wow!!!! Great rifle and great shooting - .398 worst!

P.S. Time to put the game face on and bring out some "fat sticks" LOL

 

[jelrod1]

Wow!!!! Great rifle and great shooting - .398 worst!

P.S. Time to put the game face on and bring out some "fat sticks" LOL

Ha! Looks like I need to remeasure

Thanks. I'm very happy with it so far. Good shooting for you today. Congrats.

 

[jenraegrizzard]

My submission for the bolt action shootout

Rem 700 SPS 223 1/9 twist 20 inch barrel
B&C stock
Timney Trigger
SWFA SS 20X42 scope

69 Gn Varmegeddon
23 grain varget
Lapua Brass,
Federal Premium match Small Rifle Primers
2.300 COAL

1 inch circles for targets

.559+.754+.673+.781+.650+.483= 3.9/6=.65
average group .66
best group .483
worst group .781


View attachment Over all-2.pdf

View attachment all 6 shots.pdf

View attachment close up-best shot.pdf

 

[elfster1234]

holy smokes wander! good shooting, but why 7 total groups!?

savage, criterion 6mmBR barrel.
load...6mmbr Lapua brass, 29.2 gr Varget, 105 VLD, CCI450.
best group .303"
AVE group .423
http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x403/wander6mmbr/IMG_20131201_135444_075.jpg
http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x403/wander6mmbr/IMG95201311289511173795922.jpg
http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x403/wander6mmbr/IMG_20131201_135321_081.jpg
http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x403/wander6mmbr/savage6br.jpg

 

[elfster1234]

holy $hit jelrod! you are the first person to make the honorable mention#1 with all groups under .5 !!!! damn nice my friend! i'll get ya on the boards soon!

damn dude! that is some kick ass shooting and nice rifle!

6mmBR build by Jon Beanland 10 twist Krieger.
30.6 IMR8208 XBR, 90 Berger BT at jam-.005

Best .199
Average .2956
Shot 1/1/14

 

[elfster1234]

awesome job rgrizzard's old lady! i'll get you on the boards here in a little bit. nice work & nice rifle!

if possible, please edit your existing entry's thumbnails into full size pics as per the OP rules.

Rem 700 SPS 223 1/9 twist 20 inch barrel
B&C stock
Timney Trigger
SWFA SS 20X42 scope

69 Gn Varmegeddon
23 grain varget
Lapua Brass,
Federal Premium match Small Rifle Primers
2.300 COAL

1 inch circles for targets

.559+.754+.673+.781+.650+.483= 3.9/6=.65
average group .66
best group .483
worst group .781

View attachment 25557

View attachment 25556

View attachment 25558

 

[elfster1234]

once again, you're kicking a$$ like usual! damn moboost! how many rifles do you own? I will have you on the boards really soon.

Marlin XS7 redux:
Changes: action pillar bedded to stock, brass is fireformed (instead of fireforming)

Rifle:
Action: Marlin XS7
Barrel: Brux 1:8; Remington 6mm Remington take-off; shortened, threaded for Savage and chambered by Mechanical Accuracy.
Stock: Boyds, pillar bedded
Glass: Sightron Big Sky 6.5-20x50

Weather:
52F dropping to 15F (with windshield) in 1hour, wind 7mph going to 22MPH ... shivering is not helping.

Load:
Lapua brass, 33.0 Varget, 95 Berger VLD hunting, 2925FPS

Group:
Average: .440
Smallest: .197
Longest distance POA to POI: .408

 

[elfster1234]

everything should be updated now... great shooting everyone!

damn moboost, those mod's you did made one hell of a difference! nice work with the #1 single group and bullseye bonus!

 

[elfster1234]

just an FYI everyone! unless someone wins the grand prize, we are only 4 more entries away from announcing a winner! and they will win a t-shirt thanks to marky @ tactical-tshirts ( TacticalTshirts.com | Tactical tshirts T-Shirts Tee-Shirts Gun Shirts )

Damn. That is VERY consistent. Much better than I can do.

I think your average is better than my personal all-time best single group.

TTR

 

[MoBoost]

just an FYI everyone! unless someone wins the grand prize, we are only 4 more entries away from announcing a winner! and they will win a t-shirt thanks to marky @ tactical-tshirts ( TacticalTshirts.com | Tactical tshirts T-Shirts Tee-Shirts Gun Shirts )

Why stop the fun? Bummer ..... I am just warming up; haven't shot any of the match rifles yet either.
I guess I'll dig out the good-ol' 6PPC barrel.

 

[elfster1234]

round#3 will start once this is over FYI & will repeat with a whole new winner with another t-shirt thanks to http://tacticaltshirts.com/

Why stop the fun? Bummer ..... I am just warming up; haven't shot any of the match rifles yet either.
I guess I'll dig out the good-ol' 6PPC barrel.

 

[MoBoost]

round#3 will start once this is over FYI & will repeat with a whole new winner with another t-shirt thanks to TacticalTshirts.com | Tactical tshirts T-Shirts Tee-Shirts Gun Shirts

Can we make a rule same "barrel" can't win again or something ... I got a lot of confidence in my 6PPC LOL.

 

[Dead is better]

Wow!!!! Great rifle and great shooting - .398 worst!

P.S. Time to put the game face on and bring out some "fat sticks" LOL

I've never seen shooting this good. Amazing - I shudder to think how many hours on the range you've invested to get this good mate!

 

[1slow01z71]

Well I finally made it a point to get an entry to the contest and while I didn't do so hot I suppose everyone has to start somewhere. You can clearly see which groups I shanked it pretty bad. If it weren't for the two really bad groups I think I woulda been somewhere around .75 average. On a good day this gun will shoot 5 shots in the .3s but it mainly wasn't a good day for the shooter. I had already shot about 50 rounds before I started in on these for the contest so I was a bit tired and it was close in shutdown time. With a bit more practice, patience and time I believe I could get it down in the .6s average wise. 5-6 rounds were a bit difficult to chamber due to the brass being too long so Im sure that didn't help matters none then with me pulling a few rounds, well less than stellar results.

My rifle is a bone stock 24" 5R with a timney trigger, threaded barrel and a vortex 4-16 PST. Groups were shot off of a Harris 6-9 swivel bipod and a triad rear wedge bag.

Best group was .579

Average was 1.011

Tried a few groups with the can but the 4th and 5th shots always shifted so I need to figure out whats going on with that.


Going to load another 100 rounds, trim my brass correctly this time and take my time. Maybe do two 30 round sessions. Patience isn't a virtue with me so its really hard just to sit back and take it slow. The dots on the targets are 1/2" and get covered up by my crosshairs. I think I need to go to a 1" diamond to help me center the crosshairs better which would help a bit too. Ive got plenty to work on but it was nice to see what the gun can do when Ive got my crap together. Also cant complain for a bone stock gun off the Remington production line.

 

[John1911.com]

round#3 will start once this is over FYI & will repeat with a whole new winner with another t-shirt thanks to TacticalTshirts.com | Tactical tshirts T-Shirts Tee-Shirts Gun Shirts

Correct. We are still sponsoring this competition and will do so as long as you want us to.

I stalk this thread every day. Impressive from the outside. Scary from the inside.

Marky
TTR

 

[elfster1234]

very nice entry 1slwo01z71! nice pics, rifle, and shooting. I'm looking forward to you next entry!

Well I finally made it a point to get an entry to the contest and while I didn't do so hot I suppose everyone has to start somewhere. You can clearly see which groups I shanked it pretty bad. If it weren't for the two really bad groups I think I woulda been somewhere around .75 average. On a good day this gun will shoot 5 shots in the .3s but it mainly wasn't a good day for the shooter. I had already shot about 50 rounds before I started in on these for the contest so I was a bit tired and it was close in shutdown time. With a bit more practice, patience and time I believe I could get it down in the .6s average wise. 5-6 rounds were a bit difficult to chamber due to the brass being too long so Im sure that didn't help matters none then with me pulling a few rounds, well less than stellar results.

My rifle is a bone stock 24" 5R with a timney trigger, threaded barrel and a vortex 4-16 PST. Groups were shot off of a Harris 6-9 swivel bipod and a triad rear wedge bag.

Going to load another 100 rounds, trim my brass correctly this time and take my time. Maybe do two 30 round sessions. Patience isn't a virtue with me so its really hard just to sit back and take it slow. The dots on the targets are 1/2" and get covered up by my crosshairs. I think I need to go to a 1" diamond to help me center the crosshairs better which would help a bit too. Ive got plenty to work on but it was nice to see what the gun can do when Ive got my crap together. Also cant complain for a bone stock gun off the Remington production line.

 

[usmc02xx]

WHAT BS!!! thats my rifle you cheating fucker!! hahahhaha. Damn you shot good that day Jenny, your old man can suck it. you rocked. Even if it did take buying my rig/bullet recipe to shoot it. PS, those are 69gn Sierra Match kings. The 62gn i shot it with was varmegeddons. Once again, damn good job!

Rem 700 SPS 223 1/9 twist 20 inch barrel
B&C stock
Timney Trigger
SWFA SS 20X42 scope

69 Gn Varmegeddon
23 grain varget
Lapua Brass,
Federal Premium match Small Rifle Primers
2.300 COAL

1 inch circles for targets

.559+.754+.673+.781+.650+.483= 3.9/6=.65
average group .66
best group .483
worst group .781


View attachment 25698

View attachment 25696

View attachment 25697

 

[usmc02xx]

How long are yall waiting between shots and between groups? Prior to this range outing I hadn't shot a whole lot of 5 shot groups in succession and my results were less than stellar.

I usually shoot a set of 5 right on top of each other, maybe 30 seconds to 1 minute between..... then smoke a stogey, shoot next group. whole thing in about 40 minutes.

 

[MoBoost]

Dusted off the 6PPC Savage, not shooting as well as before, different Berger lot makes me wonder.

6PPC
Savage 12LRPV
Sightron 10-50x60

.304 average
.128 best
.407 worst
.355 POI to POA

 

[MoBoost]

Here is my attempt!!!

Savage 10 single shot shilen 223 Ackley 8tw
These were shot with 55g Vmax over h-4895

Sightron SIII 8-32X56 shot off of bipod and rear bag.

Small .460
Average .692
.460+.658+1.375+.540+.639+.481= 4.153

Love the target dots

Have you tried heavies? Sometimes match barrels with tight(er) twist just don't shoot light bullets.

 

[elfster1234]

jesus dude! I just realized you posted this! damn nice shooting! i'll get you updated ASAP!

Dusted off the 6PPC Savage, not shooting as well as before, different Berger lot makes me wonder.

6PPC
Savage 12LRPV
Sightron 10-50x60

.304 average
.128 best
.407 worst
.355 POI to POA

 

[elfster1234]

john, please follow the original post guidelines for pictures and info and I'll get you on the boards. until then, your post will not count.

groups are looking good tho! very nice!

The dots came from a freight salvage co. 1000 dots for $0.12


Here is the same gun with 75g berger VLDs
small .562
average .713

 

[john_m44]

john, please follow the original post guidelines for pictures and info and I'll get you on the boards. until then, your post will not count.

groups are looking good tho! very nice!

Elfster, Id like to use post #89 as my entry.

On post #91 I was just showing MoBoost how my rifle shot with heavy bullets.
If i need to change something in that post let me know.

Thanks

 

[elfster1234]

sorry my friend, but none of your entries will count until you follow the OP.

Elfster, Id like to use post #89 as my entry.

On post #91 I was just showing MoBoost how my rifle shot with heavy bullets.
If i need to change something in that post let me know.

Thanks

 

[elfster1234]

Bumpage

 

[elfster1234]

bump love

 

[jbell]

Here is my entry. It is actually two entries in one post to save time and space. The targets were shot on separate days (one day apart), both with the same rifle, ammo, setup, and shooter.



I just did the measurement on the smallest of the two targets, I hope this works.



The rifle is an AIAW 2.0 with a 24" UK 7.62X51 barrel. It has a PMII 5-25X56 H2CMR on top and of course the Harris. All shots were from this position (prone bipod and sand bag). The air temp was the same for both days (very warm for Maine this time of year) 40-45F. I was shooting Lapua brass with a Federal 210 match primer shoved up its rear end touching off 43g of IMR4064 pushing a 175g SMK loaded at 2.805 OAL. This load seems to shoot better the farther you are from the target, so I am going to stick with it until the snow melts and I can try it at distance...



Again I hope this 2 for 1 entry works, if not feel free to shit can it. The shooting was not that impressive anyway...

 

[bm11]

Here is my first entry. I shot it today, it was about 41 degrees out. I shot with JBell. Rifle is an AIAX, barrel is an AINA .260 Bartlein, scope is a Schmidt 3-20x50 Klein, and the can is a SAS Ti Arbiter. This was actually a load development target, five different loads.









Average was 0.479", Best was 0.320". The group on the lower left started with a flier, so I used the bullet as POA to salvage the average. The last round of the last group blew my average from 0.398" to 0.479", oh well.

Thanks for running this, I know its a lot of work and you are a lot more diligent than me.

 

[MoBoost]

Good shooting!

Looks like 42.8 is the jump nod (43.0 POI is way different). I would load up some 42.3 and give it another honest go.

 

[bm11]

Good shooting!

Looks like 42.8 is the jump nod (43.0 POI is way different). I would load up some 42.3 and give it another honest go.

Thanks. The 43.0 POI was NOT off. For some reason it threw an odd flier low right, but I was lucky that it was the first round. I used the first round bullet hole as the POA for the remaining 4 rounds, gaming the system a little bit to preserve my group average.

It's weird that the last group had a round thrown too. I wonder is it was a brass prep issue? I didn't clean my primer pockets. In any case, this brass is on the 5th firing, I'll anneal the necks and uniform the pockets before the next loading. I have 97 more pieces of already primed brass to shoot before that though.

 

[hondo1312]

I thought I'd finally give this a whirl...

Average was 0.605, best was 0.527. Shots 1-5 were with southwest ammunition 136 gr Scenar-L, and shots 6-30 were with southwest ammunition 123 gr Scenar.

Rifle is a Spartan Precision 260 Rem built on a Surgeon 591 action, Bartlein 1-8tw barrel, Manners T2A stock with mini-chassis, Premier 5-25 with Gen 2XR, and TBAC 30BA suppressor.

Thanks for letting me participate!