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Federal does it again 😅
- Thread starter wvfarrier
- Start date
Strange? It was there this morning. They are discussing it on the FB group too.
Looks like they pulled the PH2 and the Gen 1 Element since this morning too.
Because when you jack up the pressure you start burning the throat out would be my guess.
who TF even messes with 11.25 for 308 anymore? retarded
80k psi and the velocities
If they’re serious about this, Fedeeal will produce standard ammo (brass cases @ 60k psi) that will probably perform nearly identically as the 280ai, including barrel life
In that simple math on every recoil calculator I’ve seen there is a place to enter powder weight. Because powder has mass too and said mass goes forward out the barrel with the bullet so there is recoil energy going back for it as well.
So if a bullet has identical velocity in 2 guns but one does it with more slow burning powder at 60k PSI and the other does it with less powder at 80k psi, the one burning less powder has less recoil energy cuz newtons law and stuff.
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this will literally wind up just like the 6.8 western. neat well performing cartridge with no support and too late in the game.
if its a rebated rim to get more powder in and get better velocity than a 7mm-08 or 7 saw etc. it may hang around a bit but the market just feels flooded nowadays and not enough components to go support it all and still way more expensive than pre covid plandimic
if its a rebated rim to get more powder in and get better velocity than a 7mm-08 or 7 saw etc. it may hang around a bit but the market just feels flooded nowadays and not enough components to go support it all and still way more expensive than pre covid plandimic
Like many before me who will stick with their 7 RM, I will stick with my 7 PRC. Also, this, I could not resist.
Agreed. There are so many 7’s that perform very similarly, in the market today. While I think a bunch of them are cool as shit, I’m not going to spend the time and money to invest in one for only one barrel. Especially when my current stable of calibers meets performance expectations for what I do with them.
The main benefit, for me personally, is watching Federal give Sig the big
on their own idea. For that alone, I hope it takes off.
What didn't you like about the 40° shoulder ? I load a 280AI for a friend and shoot a 243AI myself. My 243AI feeds from an mdt mag with greyboe bottom metal fitted in the factory laminate stock just fine also. Friends rifle is still a BDL but no problems feeding there either.
2850 with a 195 Berger out of a 20 inch barrel is nothing to sneeze at especially, out of an 06 sized case. This cartridge is really only useful for hunters but if it can be reloaded relatively easily I could see it having some success. One thing to think about with this tech is increased performance in other cartridges. Think of a 338 norma pushing into 33xc performance territory. Could be fun.
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It may just be that simple or it may be more complicated. If the 280ai case size is accurate here, with a heavy bullet, we're talking 55-60gr of usable capacity. Similar velocity 28 nosler load and we're using 80'ish grains. That's a 20-25gr difference in powder charge. Thats a significant amount of additional material to be burned. Assuming the 7mm backcountry is using a much faster burning powder (that doesnt mean higher temperatures), the burn time and pressure is generated in much less time than say the 28 nosler... the barrel is exposed to the high temps for less time with each firing. What effect that has on the barrel I'm not certain but I would assume it to be positive for barrel wear.
I think there's something going on with the higher pressures and increased efficiency. Plenty of examples where increased pressure results in increased efficiency. Google "explosive pressure VS efficiency"... ai does a decent job summarizing some of this.
Yep, just like the old '06, neither are flashy but have gotten the job done for a long fkng time.
Well this was just my personal preference but I did not come away from the 280AI project happy. I was all in at first.
One problem I had was constant pressure spike issues. I really felt the 40° shoulder contributed, if not outright caused this. I found sizing a consistent shoulder bump more difficult as well as measuring it. The SAC comparator helped immensely.
I began to feel like the 40° shoulder was simply means to an end but an imperfect solution. I think in the old days it made more sense to improve an existing cartrige.
Today I think there are plenty of good options that don’t require “bastardizing” an existing cartridge design to get a few more ponies out of it.
Sometimes you get into something and in the end for whatever reasons it does not work out how you had hoped. You form some opinions based on empirical data and gut instincts. I did not work with a bunch of rifles and a bunch of different AI cartridges so I don’t think that my opinion is at all the gold standard, by any stretch.
I don’t hate AI cartridges. I just think that in the end they’re an imperfect workaround from the past.
So this new cartridge will offer better performance than 28 Nosler,have good barrel life, no recoil, and comes in a 16.5” Savage 110.
Sounds killer to me. 300Norma, 300PRC, 7PRC are now dead.
I bet the Nightforce ELR challenge will be dominated by these.
AXSR killer if I ever saw one.
Sounds killer to me. 300Norma, 300PRC, 7PRC are now dead.
I bet the Nightforce ELR challenge will be dominated by these.
AXSR killer if I ever saw one.
Backcountry | Federal Premium
Federal’s 7mm Backcountry is an entirely new high-performance, all-range cartridge that reinvents ammunition as we know it. It not only provides superior ballistics and terminal performance, it does so through compact, shorter-barreled suppressed rifles.
www.federalpremium.com
Lots of common cartridges with ~1k barrel life, quite possibly not a problem for a hunting rifle, but TNSTAAFL.
They're definitely not bragging about barrel life.Backcountry | Federal Premium
Federal’s 7mm Backcountry is an entirely new high-performance, all-range cartridge that reinvents ammunition as we know it. It not only provides superior ballistics and terminal performance, it does so through compact, shorter-barreled suppressed rifles.
View attachment 8585734
Lots of common cartridges with ~1k barrel life, quite possibly not a problem for a hunting rifle, but TNSTAAFL.
Money money money! Is there motive I gotta think, which good night man just make money via volume of sells…. Focus on producing high selling calibers to be able to lower prices so more people are buying and shooting instead of always dreaming up niche cartridges no one really needs and end up with flops of new rifles chambered in them that will just turn into rebarrels or dust collectors..
If the Federal Terminal Ascent 170s actually go 3k in a 20" tube with factory ammo and it shoots well with decent ES, I would give one a go. Strictly talking about hunting here in the west. If the TBAC U5 would handle it, that to me would be a pretty slick setup.
If you're willing to run a long action for hunting, it won't matter if it's a standard or a magnum bolt face. And while it's true there are a few hunters out there who take shots beyond 300 yards, most of those that do prefer reloads. And since I can reload, I can neck down the 300 win mag, or the 300 PRC to 7mm and get the same velocity out of cartridges I can easily reload and get components for. Not to mention the 7mm RUM. For me, I'll stick with the 7mm Rem Mag
Meh. It's a steel cased, necked down 30-06 with a 30* shoulder. Gross. Wen 7mm BCAI?
Also, they say it gets comparable barrel life to other magnum. It looks like less powder capacity than a 280 AI but running at 80kpsi? I guess we will see on that.
Reloading will probably be hard on dies and presses.
I guess maybe the skinnier cartridge will mean maybe another round in the mag compared to PRC, but imo, it's not offering anything I really want. The 7mm PRC is already plenty of thump and the 7 RUM already exists if a person needed more.
Also, they say it gets comparable barrel life to other magnum. It looks like less powder capacity than a 280 AI but running at 80kpsi? I guess we will see on that.
Reloading will probably be hard on dies and presses.
I guess maybe the skinnier cartridge will mean maybe another round in the mag compared to PRC, but imo, it's not offering anything I really want. The 7mm PRC is already plenty of thump and the 7 RUM already exists if a person needed more.
I can't see this taking off.
Too much trade offs to get to the same level as others that are already commercially available.
The only benefit is you get .532 BF performance in a .478 BF, but you get to keep the .532 BF barrel and throat wear. Weight of ammo loadout will likely be similar so not shedding much, if any weight. Recoil might be a little less due to reduced powder capacity, I'd bet the actual felt recoil is so similar nobody would be able to shoot one effectively but not the other especially once a brake or supressor.
Too much trade offs to get to the same level as others that are already commercially available.
The only benefit is you get .532 BF performance in a .478 BF, but you get to keep the .532 BF barrel and throat wear. Weight of ammo loadout will likely be similar so not shedding much, if any weight. Recoil might be a little less due to reduced powder capacity, I'd bet the actual felt recoil is so similar nobody would be able to shoot one effectively but not the other especially once a brake or supressor.
It is interesting that Glen Seekins speaks about his feeling that “the industry” is headed for “higher pressure cartridges”. I feel like he’s talking specifically to the fury and backcountry cartridges.
Video link starts at that point.
The question is what is the trade for this higher pressure ammo.
Glen is mitigating barrel-burn somewhat, with his switch barrel rifles
Video link starts at that point.
The question is what is the trade for this higher pressure ammo.
- Hard, impractical or impossible to reload cases
- Shorter barrel life
- More recoil?
- What else?
Glen is mitigating barrel-burn somewhat, with his switch barrel rifles
My first thought when I started in this thread, oh look, now the creed crowd has competition.
I think its in the 6mm owners bi-laws they are not allowed to read or hear of any specification other than 6 mm under pain of death for hearsay/heresy by their creeplesslaroogod
I submit it is in the interests of “The Industry” to push towards new high pressure cartridges so everyone has to buy everything over again and those things bought will wear out more often thus forcing more purchases.
At the end of the day all of these supposedly “Good Dudes” exist first and foremost to separate us from our money.
As such, invent a problem and sell us the solution.
And, of course, the solution is always more “stuff” and not more training or experience…
-Stan
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just bring " super vel" ammo back made by lee jurass ,that stuff separated men from the soy bois .....if their weapon didn't blow up , man that stuff was nasty good
Federal should do the same thing with a .264 and call it the 6.5 Creedmoooor
I’m here for this steel or two piece modern high pressure case…I'd like 308win "steel" cases so I could load 185gr juggs@2800fps for use in a retuned MG3@1300rpm..
Many years ago we got 1500rpm out of a tuned MG42 in 8x57 with steel cased 186gr ammo.
And then people will ask themselves, and rightly so, why bother with a 7 BC when I already have a 280AI with enough parts and pieces to work on it immediately or already working on it.
I disclose my bias. I have 7 PRC and I like what it does but also totally understand why guys with 7 RM pushing 140 gr don't need more than that. And I have seen an elk get really dead from 7 RM.
Yes, because acceleration rate means nothing to peak recoil impulse
I never said it didn’t. I said recoil energy.
The US military is still using them... I buy em by the thousands. The 6.8 X51 hybrid can be reloaded, and used in a variety of 308 case head cartridges, 6 5 CM 308, 8.6 blkout, 358 win, are a few I utilize the case for.
I'm running stainless steel hybrid cases in variety of calbers. One can run 155 gr match at 3100 fps or 168 gr at 2940 fps in a 22" 9 twist barrel 308 with these cases.
A longer barrel and the 308 will run 200gr SMK at 2900 fps.
6.5 CM 140 grs at 3140 fps
Running high pressure cases has been around for years, good to see a major player like Federal getting into the mix with their new product.
Standard cartridges get near magnum performance in these cases.
And new powders to take advantage of the new high pressure loadings, would also be nice.
Attachments
...steel is the deal. 
That's why I call him "HACKfire"... That's a complete load of shit, unless he's downloading his 7 PRC on purpose to shill the 7 Brokeback Country with his claims. Because I remember seeing folks pushing a 24" 7 PRC with a 195 around 3,000 FPS...
Also, I have 7mm-08's, 7mm SAW, .280 AI, 7mmRM's, 7mm STW, and even at one point a 7 RUM... With combined thousands upon thousands of rounds downrange, and load development with different bullets and powders, primers, brass brands, etc... Needless to say, I love 7mm's. But that dude is full of shit as a Christmas turkey.
Appears to be factory ammo vs factory ammo amigo. Plenty of reports of factory 7 PRC ammo putting up the numbers he posted. Federal 7 prc seems to be a little faster on recent lots than hornady both with 175 eldx.
But yeah, that’s about what I ran that bullet at from 22” 7 saums.
