Cocking knob i believe extends a little longer than a standard rem 700. Bighorn went through this same lesson - their new laser engraved Tl3 wouldnt work with teh BnA tacsport so they released a lower sear. Why did ARC change the dimensions on the cokcing knob between the mausingfield and the nucleis ? F knows .. as the geissele worked fine in the mausingfield but didnt release the trigger in the nucleus (all 4) - anywaus Geissele adjusted these 4 triggers for me
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Geissele Super 700?
- Thread starter chadrp
- Start date
Cocking knob i believe extends a little longer than a standard rem 700. Bighorn went through this same lesson - their new laser engraved Tl3 wouldnt work with teh BnA tacsport so they released a lower sear. Why did ARC change the dimensions on the cokcing knob between the mausingfield and the nucleis ? F knows .. as the geissele worked fine in the mausingfield but didnt release the trigger in the nucleus (all 4) - anywaus Geissele adjusted these 4 triggers for me
Yes, it must be the Nucleus action...I look at the Geiselle trigger (in the bag it came in) and can't see what there IS to change...I don't even see what YOU found different...Did you disassemble the trigger? I'm leaving it in the bag until my JHR arrives...Which will be months from now...
I highly recommend you send your Geissele trigger to Geissele (call and get a RMA and let them know you have a Nucleus) and they will have it retrofitted with a lower sear bar/catch and back to you in 2 weeks. I have yet to see a single nucleus work with the geissele (4 of my own, about another 6-10 here) until they sent them back. Its all about geometry .. the cocking knob is longer than the sear bar on the geissele when in the fire postion hence the cocking knob catches and thus firing pin is not released or cocking knob drags on sear bar. the geissele sear bar is more like a catch in a AI, but if you get a BnA and check out the sear bars for spec cockingknob versus one that is longer (TL3, Nucleus, etc) you will see how they lowered it.
Well I took 20,000 off the cocking piece and it worked fine, so my guess is the, what I will call the lug in to deep.
Thanks for the information...I HAVE already returned my trigger to Geiselle and I informed them it was to go into a Nucleus action...They modified it and returned it to me within 10 days or so...(Via 2-day air)... This is my first semi-custom rifle and likely my one and only...Replacing a Ruger precision rifle... I'm a CASUAL user, NOT a builder...I shoot steel and varmints...I do appreciate your informative comments...I get the concept of what you said, but a lot flew mostly over my head...Lol If it doesn't work in my far-in-the-future JHR, I will send it back again to Geiselle... You have reassured me that it can and will work...That, in itself, is reassuring...Thanks
After the BnA tacsport release the BnA guys called me up and walked me through all the issues with rem 700 clones. So I got quite the education on how to measure the cocking knob relative to the two trigger pin holes to determine if in rem 700 spec or not. Geissele is returning my 4 triggers on thursday, i have 3 nucleus actions here , will let you know if they work , as neither of the 4 triggers dropped the hammer on any of the three nucleus actions.
4 gesisseles sent back today and all 4 now work in the Nucleus. Sure is a sweet trigger. Now i will see if they still work in the mausingflied, and the rem 700.
I installed 2 of the 4 i tried on the Nucleus on a rem 700 that GAP built me (Gladius) and a Mausingfield and they worked fine. Hopefully Geissele just makes whatever adjustment they made for mine on a RMA (told em i had a nucleus) for all.
As far as 2 stage precision triggers go, how is everyone liking the trigger. I know it cant get down into the ounces that some comp triggers can. But, is it low enough and crisp enough to work? Can anyone let me know what to compare it to? I have a number of Geissele AR triggers and have mainly only used Timney triggers in my bolt guns.
I’ve used mine in a coupe of matches so far and love it. Since you have some Geissele AR triggers then I would say it feels like the SSA-E but lighter with a smoother break on the second stage. The first stage take up is a little longer then some comp triggers out there but not a issue to me.
I installed mine last night and took pictures of the 2-stage adjustment instructions since they are not posted on the Geissele website and those conversion instructions are a hot mess:
Installed the Super 700 on an Alamo Precision Rifles G2 action and I cannot get the firing pin to release. The trigger is basically dead. Any adjustments I can make or do I have to send it in?
Probably send it in...I would send an email to [email protected] or call them at Phone (610) 272-2060. Perhaps there is an adjustment here. but I would call them .. https://d524kaacpo0h1.cloudfront.net/media/wysiwyg/Documents/S700_Conversion_Instructions.pdf
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Thanks. That's the next step. The trigger worked fine in a bone stock 700 action. Just wanted to see if it was something I could tweak. Looks like I can't..
I had a rifle build completed by Alamo last month. I supplied the Super 700 for them to install. This was the first they handled. It wouldn't function. The sear would hang, not making contact, thus the trigger wouldn't function. The interchanges between Alamo and Geissele was taking days. Alamo contacted me asking how I wanted to proceed. Being a novice and Alamo telling me they didn't know what was wrong I had them drop in a Timney Calvin Elite 2 stage. When I got my rifle and the Super 700 back I set forth figuring out why the trigger didn't work... more or less is there a defect or something easy to explain and remedy? After all I preordered this trigger in February 2018 specifically to have a rifle built. Like I said I'm a novice and I easily found that the fp shroud was not putting enough downward force, rather largely the forward force. I surmised that the rear pin hole was not in the right place thus not creating proper transfer bar engagement or the engagement face on the bar was wrong. I hoped it was a machining error of the pin hole, as the other scenario is more time and likely wouldn't be fixed just for me. I promptly contacted geissele with this knowledge. The fix? To my surprise geissele had created the arc version. The one they are shipping now going forward. I dropped it in and bingo. They modified the engagement face to be more generous. Now I'm frustrated that I had to deal with this but I've got to tell you... this trigger has far better feel than the Calvin elite. I would have no other in my rifle.
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Glad you got it fixed...I think Geiselle's CS and products are first rate...I'm expecting to have a JHR someday and I have a Geiselle Super 700 waiting to go in...
Glad you got it fixed...I think Geiselle's CS and products are first rate...I'm expecting to have a JHR someday and I have a Geiselle Super 700 waiting to go in...
Love my ARP and love it better with the Super 700. If you like a DMR in an AR then this one is for you. The break at the second stage is crisp, unlike the Timney. G had some some stumbles rolling this trigger out but they make it right.
Had fun getting my first bolt gun together. Maybe I'll show off in a fresh post sometime soon.
Had fun getting my first bolt gun together. Maybe I'll show off in a fresh post sometime soon.
Put a super 700 in my curtis vector. Dry fired, the firing pin fell. Went to lift the bolt to cycle and couldn't lift the bolt. Sending to geissele through rma. The trigger felt great when doing the dry fire up until the bolt staying locked down. I really want this trigger to work. I have a BnA 2 stage tacsport in the vector right now and idk how i feel about it.
The Super 700 will absolutely not work in an Alamo Precision Rifles G2 action. A buddy of mine RMA'ed a second run Super 700 for the new ones that work on the Nucleus hoping that it would work in the G2 action. No dice.. Good thing Brownell's has a good return policy. It worked just fine in a stock Remington 700. Great feeling trigger but just too picky.
Man I hate to hear that for you. My APR has their Hunter action... it's the most current version of it. I didn't think there was much difference between the two in the area of the action where the fcg interacts with the fp shroud. I was under the impression that in fact they have the same bolt, less a different fp. Though it made no impact, I had found that there was some burrs on the interface of my fp shroud. I got out a fine stone for working sears and polished the face, knocked roughly a 2 thou edge bevel, smoothed the bottom face and sides (so there was no conflict with the trigger cartridge, and finally knocked the edge off the sides as there is no reason for them to be sharp. Maybe something to look at?
In my conversations with Geissele I mentioned that the producer of the actions were just an hour away from them and it would be worth their time to touch base with them as APR is churning out quite a bit of product.
Any recommendations for 2 stage triggers that work with the G2 action? I was just about to buy a super 700 for mine until I read these last few comments
Well after loving this trigger in my R700s I tried another for a Bighorn Origin I've been putting together. It won't fire. I am surprised as even some of the first run triggers from previous posters worked with their origins. I would think I got one of the later ones after Geissele did the modifications as I just ordered the trigger a couple weeks ago from Brownells. I am going to contact Geissele but thought I'd share that it doesn't work with every origin action, at least not as is. I may try my other super 700s on this action too, just to see what happens. Either way, I'm confident Geissele will help me get this resolved.
How did you accomplish this? A mill? And when you say the cocking piece are you talking about the part of the firing pin that engages the trigger? Or are you talking about the part of the trigger that engages the firing pin?
A file or mill and no, do not touch the trigger. I would advise sending it back to Bighorn and having it timed correctly.
As for the problems with the Super 700 and Bighorn, I to had issues with several super 700's on my Origin not functioning. I also had troubles with a Surgeon I used to have as well. At the time, Geissle didn't have answers and just offered for me to send both my actions in for them to take a look at.
Good to know, it looks like the firing pin would be way easier to modify than the trigger so that's what I was hoping. Anyways, I talked to Geissele, they are going to get me the same mod that they use for the Nucleus actions. I expect this to solve the problem, if it does not I will look into shaving a small amount off of the bottom of the firing pin, I really don't expect to need to do that though.
Strange to hear of people have problems with the origin and super 700. I have two of each and they both function perfectly and have the same feel (which is what I was going for). Best of luck, I'm sure G will make it right.
Thank you, yes I'm also sure I'll be all set in a couple weeks. I have been paying fairly close attention to this forum and there are at least a couple accounts of them working fine with Origins, so I really didn't anticipate this at all. It seemed the Nucleus was the only major problem. Anyways, in my case the tolerances probably just stacked up, not in my favor.
Just a quick update...I bought the Geissele originally from Brownells...I sent the trigger to Geissele because I knew it might not work in the Nucleus...They promptly sent one back and I had high hopes...When my JHR arrived (Nucleus action) it worked, but only part-time... I contacted them again and sent that one back...I just received an email from Justin at Geissele and he said the trigger I sent back the second time did NOT have the Nucleus adjustment, and he is sending me the proper one!!! AND a free shirt!!! At one point, I talked to 'Nick' I believe...Turned out to be Mr. Geiselle himself...Outstanding customer service. I'm confident the trigger will work fine...I do love a 2-stage, light trigger...
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I'm not sure exactly what they mean by "true two stage" in that they mention two seers in their marketing. I am aware of two stage triggers that put no force on the second stage during the first. This is said to be preferable to those that apply load to the second stage durring the first as I have been told there can be issues with 2 stage triggers having some movement of the second stage during the first and not moving totally back to full seer engagement if pressure is then let off leaving them in a less safe configuration. In any case, the Bix'n Andy does not apply any force to the second stage during the first. It could also be adjusted to be a single stage trigger by the user if the user decided he preferred single stage function after trying two stage. Essentially, both the single stage, and two stage versions are the same, two stage design. They just don't put a hole for one of the set screws in the single stage. I have a pretty good diagram of how the thing works in the Bix'n Andy TacSport review.
Though I caught a lot of the new triggers at ShotShow this year, I missed the Geissele and have not seen any diagrams of how it, or the other C.G. 22 based triggers such as the X-Treme 22 work. If anybody has a link to one of these with the case side off or a video with an acrylic side one being explained I would be interested. I am acquainted with principles behind the Jewel, Bix'n Andy, and TriggerTech designs but for all the bragging I have seen on the C.G.22 designs, their 4 levers, and true 2-stage designs, I have not seen anything on how they work.
Jim! Excited to talk to you as I actually read your review back when you first wrote it. Yeah that's what I'm talking about, the "less safe" state of the trigger you're describing. With the super 700 there is actually a little port you can watch what's happening with the sear movement. On the super 700 there is a lot of overlap between the re-cocking lever and sear lever and as you pull through the first stage the re-cocking lever moves down until you hit the "wall" where it is just barely holding the sear lever back, at which point you are very close to firing and a small amount of additional force allows the sear lever to move past the re-cocking lever which allows the transfer lever to fall and firing pin to spring forward. However if you release the trigger instead, the re-cocking lever moves all the way back up to it's original location to give a large amount of overlap with the sear lever again creating a very safe trigger. See attached a photo of the port where you can see the sear movement, shown in the bolt lifted state. When you close the bolt the sear lever moves back and down and comes in full contact with the re-cocking lever.
My understanding of a lot of the 2 stage triggers out there is that they don't actually move the levers at all during the first stage, you just pull against a spring until you get to the "wall" but the re-cocking and sear levers are sitting right on the razors edge of each other just like any single stage trigger would be from the moment the bolt is closed. So for those 2 stage triggers you don't get the safety advantage of a true 2-stage trigger and hence why they're not considered a "true" 2-stage. That was the root of my question about the tacsport. So my question is, looking at your photo of the tacsport again, does the 2 stage version create a lot of overlap between the two levers at the point you call "sear point" ? As I study the picture again it seems that is possible, but on the other hand, when I look at the picture where you show both versions, it seems the 2 stage might simply be a case where you pull against what looks like a slightly longer spring than the 1 stage creating a "2-stage" trigger but without giving any additional lever overlap. I'd love some confirmation and even a picture if you or anyone has one that shows the 2 stage trigger with the side off in the cocked state, just like you did on the single stage.
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I'm not able to really visualize how the super 700 works from this description. I'm also not that familiar with the nomenclature of the different levers in a 4 lever trigger system. At some point I expect I will need to see one of these things with the side off and in a couple different states (cocked, ie. pressure on topsear and fired) in order to understand how it works.
As for the TacSport's two stage function. In the first stage you are just pulling against the main spring (the big one on the left in the photos.) The rest of the levers do not move at all in the first stage. They sit just as they would in a single stage trigger. It is no safer, or less safe, than a single stage trigger in this regard. Here is the two stage in cocked position labeled.
@BigJimFish thanks for the reply, that does confirm what I was wondering about on the TacSport.
Sorry I wasn't able to explain well the function of the super 700. I've never taken the cover off of mine and don't really plan to. I am very curious and would love to see a bit more of it myself, but I'm not willing to risk the $200+ investment at this time.
Sorry I wasn't able to explain well the function of the super 700. I've never taken the cover off of mine and don't really plan to. I am very curious and would love to see a bit more of it myself, but I'm not willing to risk the $200+ investment at this time.
I received my Geissele Super 700 trigger back from Geissele today...I swapped out the Timney 510 trigger that came with my PVA, JHR (ARC Nucleus action)... This time it worked flawlessly!!! It is, of course, configured as a two-stage trigger...It can be configured to a total pull weight between 12 oz. to 3.5 lbs... I reduced the overall pull weight to about 2 lbs...It is hard to measure, but I think the 2nd stage is now around 12 oz... VERY crisp break with no creep in the second stage...Very little take up after the break...Trigger weight, second stage weight, and trigger overtravel all adjustable...I've been corresponding with Justin at Geissele and he has been great!!! I'm going to love this trigger.....Outstanding customer service. I'm confident the trigger will work fine...I do love a 2-stage, light trigger...
