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Member Link Up Puget Sound Area Shooter's Group
- Thread starter -Nick-
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To be fair a switchview isnt something to common for most people. Im not surprised that they hadnt heard ot it. Same as i hadnt heard of it and used google. Now if you had said lever to change power on a scope easier then i would have known exactly what you wanted. The 40moa rail i could possibly see. Depend son context. If it was i need a 40MOA to mount my scope to and they didnt know, then yeah. but if it was just i need a 40MOA rail i could see someone more familiar with handguns being a bit confused.
DGS needs to just go away. I never see people in the Port Orchard store. Ive stopped by twice trying to find something fast with no luck. Was looking for scope rings and they had ZERO. Not a sing set for sale. The other time was just to look and i saw what they had, saw mosins posted at 230 bucks, laughed and walked out.
Boerners is a weird one. Ive heard great advice there, but then i have also heard some terrible advice given there. I usually just stop in to browse when killing time. Bought one gun there and thats probably all i will buy there.
Sportsmens is (sadly) where i end up buying most of my stuff. They just actually have a selection of everything. Id love to buy locally but DGS and Boerners hardly carry anything outside of guns IMO.
FWIW DGS is one of the only places in the area that offers the Efile now on the Class 3 items... At least in our area. Their Guns and Ammo are WAY over priced but ill never complain about more options. Sportmens has some good powders in on a regular basis. Grabbed 12# of RL17 this last week, that should be enough to get me though the year...
Oh Midway has #450 Primers in stock for you SRM users looking for some. $150 for 5K not bad....
Oh Midway has #450 Primers in stock for you SRM users looking for some. $150 for 5K not bad....
They must have literally just gotten approved since when I asked their manager if they were doing that yet he said they were waiting for approval and that was maybe 2 weeks ago.
Boerners... another gem of Kidnap County, lol. As for powders it's been rather slim up until the other day. I try to let everyone on here know when powders come in. Since they changed the normal shipping dates the best time is late Tuesday afternoon or first thing Wednesday morning. Occasionally they'll get random shipments late in the week. We did just have in a few 1 & 8lb Varget containers. One of the 8lbers walked out with Russ and the other one mysteriously made it home with me
lol...
Switchview, I wonder what company came up with that name, whatever the hell happened to the old Cat tail, Charley Drissell had making these for decades before I ever heard of a switchview.
I believe it was Vortex Marty. They were the first to really push it, but unfortunately the price was well... a little out there.
Well not to change the subject but here is a link to the 2014 FSC April 26-27
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...sc-april-26-27-ellensburg-wa.html#post2924104
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...sc-april-26-27-ellensburg-wa.html#post2924104
Scott looking forward to another Field Shooters Challenge
Nick thanks for the info, did they think they were reinventing the wheel, Cat Tail
Nick thanks for the info, did they think they were reinventing the wheel, Cat Tail
new to the hide i was going through some old threads seeing what some of the topics that were talked about and one was max caliber for matchs and how large magnums tear up the steel at close range. I have had steel on my own range now for several years now. There is one steel i've found that is truely bullet proof regardless of velocity or bullet weight and that is pads off of cat tracks. Cut the pad off at the grouser and weld acouple together cut your pattern out and you have sillawet that"will" last forever. I have several thousand rnds on mine mostly with 308 and 300wm and not one dent, crator nothing! shot some green tip 223 at 50yd and if you looked close there was avery small spot that looked like a deep rust pocket. They have been shot with several calibers to say the least but mostly 308 and 300wm.
Sgm, if I shot your steel with my paltry 223 at the monthly matches, Kevin or Anton would have an impossible time scoring me. But it does bring up an interesting question that I can ask Jake, I wonder if he could make me a target with 1/4 or 3/8 that I might have a chance of hearing a ding. I shot my small IPSC last week and it sounded good at 500 but any further and its a crap shoot. I do like the 300 though, Bigwheels has gotten pretty far out there with consistent hits. And several of us know Eric, Steve and Annie, I would really like to get out there this June.
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I have found over the years that if you hang the steel on conveyor belt or fire hose the steel rings better. Chain tends to absorb the vibration. Also the size of the steel makes a huge difference. My full size sil rings like a bell & the deep tone carries a long way. I've actually heard it ring from 2000yds once on a quiet day. The small plates just go "tink". But a 223 doesn't hit hard enough to get a good ring either way.
I think what you most want is play. The more the plate can move the better. And steel type seems to matter. My AR500 plates ring like bells.
I only sometimes heard the steel out at Acme last time I was there using my 308 but I could see the strikes so it was all good.
Electronic ear protection helps a ton. But the tone of the sound makes a big difference as well. Fog horns are low pitch because low frequency sound travels farther.
As people get older their hearing of higher pitches diminishes first. The same is said with most hearing loss. So a deeper tone is definitely more beneficial. When you deal with hearing impaired if they're having a harder time hearing you try lowering your voice and you'd be surprised how much better they understand you.
Unfortunately Nick, I resemble that remark, but it's not just pitches at this stage. Background noise etc, and get me in a room full of peoples and I'm trying to lipread or get the fook out of there.
Chainsaws, firearms, pumps, mowers, lack of hearing protection in youth, all cumulative. I've got tinutus(sp?), but currently try to protect what i've got left with plugs and muffs. Also, I pack plugs when I'm hunting, and try and shove them in before the shot. To you younger folks that still have good hearing...Protect It!! (So if we're having a conversation or some semblance of one, and you think I'm ignoring you, it's PROBABLY because I didn't hear you... or perhaps you just pissed me off...)
For those out there searching for powder, there's several pounds of H4350 at Peninsula Pro Shop in Belfair.
The large magnums pock mark the steel, ferrous bullets of any kimd craters them and increases ricochette. The biggest problem with magnums is that they knock over the target stands at 100 and 200 yards, and resetting the targets slows the match down too much.
If there is a stage requiring two hits on a target, and the magnum knocls it over with the first hit, the match is a bust for everyone.
We could buy really heavy steel, biut then the 5.56 shooters would have an even harder time hearing hits. Almost all our targets are now mounted using fire hose, and that helps quite a bit.
If there is a stage requiring two hits on a target, and the magnum knocls it over with the first hit, the match is a bust for everyone.
We could buy really heavy steel, biut then the 5.56 shooters would have an even harder time hearing hits. Almost all our targets are now mounted using fire hose, and that helps quite a bit.
He was talking about using the CAT tracks which don't pot mark, and bigger targets typically ring louder. I figured out how to keep the stands from falling over. Maybe when I get some time I'll show Eric and he can show you guys.
I hope everyone knows about the inexpensive "Cat-tail" or Switchview. Cheap on eBay or Amazon, Work just as well on all scope types and lighter as well:
breakaway coaster | eBay
Also, another tip while I'm at it. For those of you with suppressors, everyone always says it takes 150% of the effort to take them off as to put them on, due to recoil rotation and/or carbon buildup. I spray Boron Nitride (a high performance high heat lubricant) on the muzzle threads or muzzle brake suppressor mount threads (on the outside of the muzzle brakes meant for suppressor mounting) and the suppressor comes off only very slightly harder than it goes on -- almost the same. If you can't find Boron Nitride, I bet any of the modern lubes which claim to bond to the metal (such as Breakfree, CLP, Fireclean, etc.) would do about the same thing.
breakaway coaster | eBay
Also, another tip while I'm at it. For those of you with suppressors, everyone always says it takes 150% of the effort to take them off as to put them on, due to recoil rotation and/or carbon buildup. I spray Boron Nitride (a high performance high heat lubricant) on the muzzle threads or muzzle brake suppressor mount threads (on the outside of the muzzle brakes meant for suppressor mounting) and the suppressor comes off only very slightly harder than it goes on -- almost the same. If you can't find Boron Nitride, I bet any of the modern lubes which claim to bond to the metal (such as Breakfree, CLP, Fireclean, etc.) would do about the same thing.
Scott looking forward to another Field Shooters Challenge
Nick thanks for the info, did they think they were reinventing the wheel, Cat Tail
the steel from the track pads i used was from a d8 high track the plates after cutting the grouser side off they are 3/4" thick, smaller cats would be thinner. i paid scrap price for the steel, they ware out and construction companys have to replace them[have construction co. in family]. i can here mine out to 700yds ok if the winds not blowing but i shoot a 308 or 300wm. i hang them with 3/8 cable when i used a strip of tire tred it definatly took some ring out of them, but the price is right and i"ll never wear them out. my boy shot one at 100ft with his 300wm 165 nosler part. at max load 3250fps and didnt do any damage at all so he used 223 green tip penatrators and they left what looked like the little rust pockets i mentioned earlyer. i know it is hard to believe. i think the d6 is next in line for traks they were thinner but i'm not shure just how thick they are but i will tring to get some also...steve
mjh30, i gave a couple small sillewets to eric last spring, he said he's been using them for his close suff. i asked him this fall if there has been any damage to them he said not at all, give him a call and i'm sure he'd give u an update on them. the june match is the one i try to make also, couldnt make it last year but did the year before last[the hot one, 105 when i left]eric puts on a fine shoot.
I'll drop by Navy City and talk with old man Tony. I'll see if he has scrap from the shipyard. He might have some HY80 or HY100 plate steel drop from ship refits. What would be some good sizes to have him keep an eye out for?
Sgm, they are good people. With regards to the steel targets, I have been using Jakes which are obviously ar500, i' m not sure who I had the conversation with, but it might even been with him, but I was under the impression that a thinner plate that is normally used might give me some ting at longer distances using the 223. I'm quite happy with the steel that I am using rings nice for the 260 and 308, just thinking about what might work for the lighter bullets better at extended distances. I normally just use a fence post and the t-post hanger and it works quite fine, I even loosen the bolts attaching the bracket to give some extra slop. Finding myself playing more with my 223 and the 77 grainers, since I've had the 260 and 308 for a while, my have to explore the idea of a target can.
Listed a scope for sale guys if anyone is interested
Marty
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...modified-dot-excellent-shape.html#post2927046
Marty
http://www.snipershide.com/shooting...modified-dot-excellent-shape.html#post2927046
one thing that i did on a large s.wet was to put a clanger on the back it hangs on the back from a chain. i like to shoot in the wind and its at 700yrds and my hearing is poor put the 3 together and i need all the help i can get. if it doesnt work as well as u hoped u can always cut it back off. if u decide to try one let me know, got a couple tips...steve
mjh, i kind of went around the subject of the plate thickness. yes from my experience the thinner plates do ring better regardless, the clanger method does work for me. my neigbor says if the wind isnt blowing to hard it sounds like somone hitting a frying pan with a sledge hammer and he is about 2/3 mile from the s.wet i know i can here it real well at 700yds, so i 'think' it would ok with smaller s.wet and 223. i have a 223 shooting 69gr that i just started working with, when i get a chance i'll take a 12"-3/4" s.wet and put a clanger on it and see what happens!...steve
I know he was talking about cat tracks. I was commenting about why we don't use magnums on the steel we currently have in use. Our steel is already showing some serious pock marks..if they get any worse we would have to consider taking them out of use.
We let a couple of fellows shoot the steel with rifles that they promised were reduced velocity loads in magnums. Even believing that they are using reduced loads doesn't eliminate the damage to our steel.
Bill Bagwell (famous knife maker) has lomng favored using cat tracks (he calls them grouser bars) for forging into knives.
if you would like i can you make up one and you can take it out and abuse it with the fastest barrel burners you got. just give me some dimensions and how your going to hang it and i"ll do my best...i have 2 pieces left, they are 3/4" thick/ 6"" wide/ 24"long they can be welded together so the weld does not pock or erode and then cut your patern out. but if you a small one that will rock with small caibers i can cut one out of the 6" pieces. i dont beleive you would ever have to replace it with my expereince.....when i said eric puts on a great match i should have said sage flats does, did'nt mean to leave out[eric] steve, ann, the land owners kelly, jodi an others [ro's ect..] that make it great fun!! apolgys.....steve
howdy fellas, im interested in getting in line for a suppressor, it sounds like the efile has sped the process up. I have no idea on witch way to go, trust or form 4. I have herd with a form 4 I need to acquire a signature from a sheriff and get a few passport pictures, and what would be the best way to approach the signatures. I know I want a thunderbeast just not sure how to get it home and if I want to jump through all the hoops. what are your opinions I live in king co.
I would go Trust, especially as getting CLEO sign-off over there will be easier said than done.
Hi Guys,
Long time no post for me, still lurking around here regularly but not doing much shooting. I was wondering if the collective knowledge base here could help me out a bit? I have a Paraordnance P14 aluminum frame and 2 mags I'm thinking of selling and have no idea what to ask for it. Anybody have any idea what a fair price might be?
Thanks, Mike
Long time no post for me, still lurking around here regularly but not doing much shooting. I was wondering if the collective knowledge base here could help me out a bit? I have a Paraordnance P14 aluminum frame and 2 mags I'm thinking of selling and have no idea what to ask for it. Anybody have any idea what a fair price might be?
Thanks, Mike
AKMike,
I know I'm in a minority, but I have had great results with Para's...I carried an alloy P-13 as a duty gun, and competed with steel framed P-14's for many years. If your pistol has night sites, beavertail, or any aftermarket add ons, they could raise the price. Check gunbroker, and gunsamerica to see what other people are asking, and what they actually sell for. You might also check out Seattleguns, northwestfirearms, and some of the other boards to find out about local values.
Keep in mind that there are regional preferences that make some guns more valuable in different areas. In some areas of the country, revolvers bring considerably more money than in other areas. That pretty much applies to most guns. You might also want to let people know if there are any trades you are interested in. Straight up cash sales are sometimes difficult for people. Best of luck.
I know I'm in a minority, but I have had great results with Para's...I carried an alloy P-13 as a duty gun, and competed with steel framed P-14's for many years. If your pistol has night sites, beavertail, or any aftermarket add ons, they could raise the price. Check gunbroker, and gunsamerica to see what other people are asking, and what they actually sell for. You might also check out Seattleguns, northwestfirearms, and some of the other boards to find out about local values.
Keep in mind that there are regional preferences that make some guns more valuable in different areas. In some areas of the country, revolvers bring considerably more money than in other areas. That pretty much applies to most guns. You might also want to let people know if there are any trades you are interested in. Straight up cash sales are sometimes difficult for people. Best of luck.
Thanks for the reply! This is actually just a frame not a complete pistol. I didn't phrase it very well in my post, lol. That probably makes it harder to come up with a price.
A little while ago I was able to speak with the guy in charge of the gates for DNR up in my AO. He was a good guy to talk to, & he gave me a name to contact in Sierra Pacific Timber whom I have not contacted yet. After considerable mental anguish on the subject I've decided to just throw up what he told me about getting access to closed off areas.
There are potentially 2 ways we can gain access to these areas as far as DNR land is concerned.
1: We will need to create an organization. Once this is done the org. will need to purchase necessary insurance, & pay the $500-$1000 security deposit per key to get a key to the gate/gates in question. The state may in the end decide to deny our org. the requested access. I see this as the most effective way to get what we want, but it will also be the worst way. The only way I see to do this is to create a legal entity with a board, treasurer, keeper of keys, etc. Everyone wanting to join will have to pay a membership fee to operate the org. as well as to pay for the insurance, & security deposits for the various gates they have access to.(if any) As you all are no doubt aware, any insurance involving any kind of fire arm is going to be expensive to say the least. So this in, and of itself may blow the whole idea out of the water.
2: There is apparently a "new" Adopt a Gate program recently put in existence. The guy I talked to couldn't tell me how to even go about applying for the program. Maybe someone knows someone in Olympia that might shed more light on it for us. As it was explained to me it is similar to the Adopt a Road program where we would also have to organize into a "group", & if granted we would do periodic maintenance of the area behind, & around the gate. This would in theory give us a key to the gate, & some shooting activities could be done in conjunction with the maintenance. I do not know at this time if insurance is required for this option, but as with any other "civilian entity" operating with the state I would bet it is a requirement. I'm also quite sure the security deposit will still be required.
Now I see a multitude of potential problems with either of these options.
1: No matter what everyone isn't going to get their own key to the gate they want. Someone will have to be assigned control of the key/keys in the broad areas, & will have to distribute them to the various groups who want to shoot on a given day/weekend. Everyone given use of a key will have to abide by certain rules. Such as only allowing members of the org. to accompany them behind the gate. I know some will object to this, but unless they can somehow verify any guest is somehow insured for liability I don't see it working out. And the key must be returned promptly.
2: Given the dispersed nature of our "group" I see many conflicts arising over who gets a given key on a particular day. I'm sure this could be worked out with a central scheduling program operated by the org. but I forsee the potential to devolve into incessant squabbling among members all wanting to get a key, & so, & so didn't bring it back to the "Keeper" on time. Not to mention the temptation to make duplicates for ones "personal" use.
3: Either way someone will have to ride herd on the whole thing. Some kind of governing body would be necessary so an election system would need to be created. People would have to "run for office" as it were.
4: Even if we are successful I don't see any way to keep it secret from the "anti's" who will come unglued when they find out we were able to do this. I forsee considerable sabotage of our efforts to continue, & even to begin for that matter.
This is just a starting point. I'm sure if we take the matter seriously the organization could be formed. Whether or not we could ultimately succeed is an open question.
As for me. I am still planning to leave this state, as soon as I can take care of some family obligations, for conservative states down south. So I'll not be much involved in the long run. Someone else will have to take this on if it is to have a chance.
And so it begins...
There are potentially 2 ways we can gain access to these areas as far as DNR land is concerned.
1: We will need to create an organization. Once this is done the org. will need to purchase necessary insurance, & pay the $500-$1000 security deposit per key to get a key to the gate/gates in question. The state may in the end decide to deny our org. the requested access. I see this as the most effective way to get what we want, but it will also be the worst way. The only way I see to do this is to create a legal entity with a board, treasurer, keeper of keys, etc. Everyone wanting to join will have to pay a membership fee to operate the org. as well as to pay for the insurance, & security deposits for the various gates they have access to.(if any) As you all are no doubt aware, any insurance involving any kind of fire arm is going to be expensive to say the least. So this in, and of itself may blow the whole idea out of the water.
2: There is apparently a "new" Adopt a Gate program recently put in existence. The guy I talked to couldn't tell me how to even go about applying for the program. Maybe someone knows someone in Olympia that might shed more light on it for us. As it was explained to me it is similar to the Adopt a Road program where we would also have to organize into a "group", & if granted we would do periodic maintenance of the area behind, & around the gate. This would in theory give us a key to the gate, & some shooting activities could be done in conjunction with the maintenance. I do not know at this time if insurance is required for this option, but as with any other "civilian entity" operating with the state I would bet it is a requirement. I'm also quite sure the security deposit will still be required.
Now I see a multitude of potential problems with either of these options.
1: No matter what everyone isn't going to get their own key to the gate they want. Someone will have to be assigned control of the key/keys in the broad areas, & will have to distribute them to the various groups who want to shoot on a given day/weekend. Everyone given use of a key will have to abide by certain rules. Such as only allowing members of the org. to accompany them behind the gate. I know some will object to this, but unless they can somehow verify any guest is somehow insured for liability I don't see it working out. And the key must be returned promptly.
2: Given the dispersed nature of our "group" I see many conflicts arising over who gets a given key on a particular day. I'm sure this could be worked out with a central scheduling program operated by the org. but I forsee the potential to devolve into incessant squabbling among members all wanting to get a key, & so, & so didn't bring it back to the "Keeper" on time. Not to mention the temptation to make duplicates for ones "personal" use.
3: Either way someone will have to ride herd on the whole thing. Some kind of governing body would be necessary so an election system would need to be created. People would have to "run for office" as it were.
4: Even if we are successful I don't see any way to keep it secret from the "anti's" who will come unglued when they find out we were able to do this. I forsee considerable sabotage of our efforts to continue, & even to begin for that matter.
This is just a starting point. I'm sure if we take the matter seriously the organization could be formed. Whether or not we could ultimately succeed is an open question.
As for me. I am still planning to leave this state, as soon as I can take care of some family obligations, for conservative states down south. So I'll not be much involved in the long run. Someone else will have to take this on if it is to have a chance.
And so it begins...
Joe W. can't make it to the match at UNSC this coming Saturday, so if anyone wants to shoot in his spot, let Kevin know. Kevin is controlling the list for the February 2014 match.
Good Deal DJ!! That is why, in part, this match is hosted. Matt loved helping get new shooters involved in the sport (of course you already know that). My brother-in-law is using my Benchmark .308 or I would have an extra rifle. "The Affair" (<---my wife loves that i named my primary that) is staying in the safe to preserve barrel life
Another friend of Matt's has gotten involved in sponsorship and right now and it looks like we will have a pretty good sponsored prize table.
This is good. We get our own lock and multiple keys and we're in business. I'll sign up as a key holder. I need the range time.
Jeff, I may be able to help.
I own a Steel Target Business. We do demo days all the time. We have a $2,000,000 insurance policy.(yes it is expensive, but I have to have it to run events etc.)
We have a president, treasurer, etc. etc.
If we can be of any help just let me know. Would love to get that spot opened up for a select few guys to go shoot, and clean up, and take care of our land, and do some community demo days to help youngsters get involved with shooting the right way. Etc. Etc. You get the point.
--Jake--
I own a Steel Target Business. We do demo days all the time. We have a $2,000,000 insurance policy.(yes it is expensive, but I have to have it to run events etc.)
We have a president, treasurer, etc. etc.
If we can be of any help just let me know. Would love to get that spot opened up for a select few guys to go shoot, and clean up, and take care of our land, and do some community demo days to help youngsters get involved with shooting the right way. Etc. Etc. You get the point.
--Jake--
