- Nov 3, 2010
- 9,350
- 19,355
That rifle will be broke soon with two “destroyers” handling it
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View thread Contact supportThat rifle will be broke soon with two “destroyers” handling it
Nah. just a poor
God i’d love one. But AI ATs keep climbing in price. To the point where a 700 smithed up to an M40 getting same accuracy is a cheaper solution. Last lefty AT was like $7500 and the new offerings from AI seem to be straying away from the old tried and true.
Accuracy isn’t the only thing.God i’d love one. But AI ATs keep climbing in price. To the point where a 700 smithed up to an M40 getting same accuracy is a cheaper solution. Last lefty AT was like $7500 and the new offerings from AI seem to be straying away from the old tried and true.
I get that. Luckily my old poor 700s keep trucking no failures. Though i have seen some remmys fail. Like i say id love an AI. But finding a lefty is a pain. Id also like the AT over the axsr.Accuracy isn’t the only thing.
There’s a reason AI / cadex / trg / trash can mrad cost what they do
The used AT used to just sit in the px. Got the one above for just over $3k. Since discontinuation they seem to keep climbing in the px. As we figured they would.God i’d love one. But AI ATs keep climbing in price. To the point where a 700 smithed up to an M40 getting same accuracy is a cheaper solution. Last lefty AT was like $7500 and the new offerings from AI seem to be straying away from the old tried and true.
Regarding barrel specs, that's pretty standard. Defiance wont give anyone a tenon print for their actions. Their position is any gunsmith worth their salt can figure it out.My complaints:
Overpriced
Proprietary Attachment system/Triggers (see also Overpriced).
AI told me to pound sand when I asked about getting barrel specs for my smith.
My non-complaints:
the fucker shoots.
Stupid people complain about bolt lift. Its never been an issue for me.
In todays world/market: A custom action build is a better bet from a high class smith in the stock/chassis of your choice. Market caught AI, they aren't offering anything different except more $$$. They aren't bad. But if I can get the same features and reliability for 2k less, I'm gonna take that option.
Can we revisit the part you were talking about COD players? The thing is; every sentence ends with a “those cod players” is a losing argument.I simply stated my opinion, and you're the one who actually took it to heart to write all that shit out (speaking of word-salad verbal diarrhea)... I don't have any personal issue with AI. I didn't take any of it personal, but you sure as hell did judging by all your shrieking butthurt. I couldn't give less of a shit about a Tikka. And 700's are the lowest rung on my personal list of custom rifle build actions to choose from. Savage and many others are just garbage that I will never own, or recommend to anyone.
You're welcome to revisit whatever parts of whatever I've posted whenever you want...Doesn't make a shit to me. But what I do find funny, is that you're butthurt about my comments about how a lot of grown men who play video games like to LARP about some "boogaloo" scenario that will probably never happen in our lifetime...Can we revisit the part you were talking about COD players? The thing is; every sentence ends with a “those cod players” is a losing argument.
So lets take a deep dive.
Clearly you can read; and somewhat form coherent sentences using an electronic device. So you are not stranger to computers….
What happened with the cod player? What really damaged you? ARE you sure it was a COD player?
Unless you had this trauma with an actual gamer; i do not see how a person that plays video games is relevant to this conversation.
However we can group therapy here and walk you through this. Let us help you.
Well then Defiance is stupid too. And I will note that they didn't say "Have your gunsmith measure it" (Even though he did). What's the point of a barrel change system if you don't tell everyone the specs. That's fucking obtuse.Regarding barrel specs, that's pretty standard. Defiance wont give anyone a tenon print for their actions. Their position is any gunsmith worth their salt can figure it out.
I briefly had an AT but sold it pretty quickly since the ergonomics weren't for me. Also the AW magazine that was included with it would let a 6.5CM round pop loose if I didn't put the magazine in the rifle very slowly/carefully. So I'd most of the time insert the magazine and immediately have to fish out a loose round. But that was just a magazine issue.
I do wonder with how far custom actions such as Impact/Lone Peak have come, how much people are actually losing in a reliability sense when they use those instead of an AI. I don't think the gap between the two is nearly as big now.
Nah i could have gone along with most of the things you said until you categorized bunch of people in a distasteful manner. You have a messaging problem. Nothing is wrong with larping, playing video games and simultaneously owning a gun.You're welcome to revisit whatever parts of whatever I've posted whenever you want...Doesn't make a shit to me. But what I do find funny, is that you're butthurt about my comments about how a lot of grown men who play video games like to LARP about some "boogaloo" scenario that will probably never happen in our lifetime...
Copy... You like video games. More power to you...Go enjoy your video games, do what makes you happy. But that doesn't change the facts in what I said.
This is 100% what happens to me at every match in whatever shooting discipline I do. I know I'm better than some, but there's some true talent out there.Come shoot a Match. If you can stand being humbled you might learn something
Actually, people who buy AI's would be more Boomer/Fudd than people who don't, based simply upon AI's time frame of heaviest service use and their "glory days" when they were the top dog. And no, I don't get on ARFcom... Never have, never will.Nah i could have gone along with most of the things you said until you categorized bunch of people in a distasteful manner. You have a messaging problem. Nothing is wrong with larping, playing video games and simultaneously owning a gun.
I bet you get on arf and fight KAC people. Hey maybe that is your turn on who knows…or just maybe, mayybeeeee you are a fudd…
I'll be happy to offer my AW for any dirt/sand/ice/snow/parachute jump comparison vs any of those modern custom actions.
I owned customs and know pretty well which one is going down first. Anyone assuming a Remington 700 type action equals an AI is the only one butthurt in here. A Defiance might be way higher quality than a standard Remmy, however, it is still a Remmy.
Friends deviance went down with a broken extractor after 2000 rounds.
If my life depended on it, i'll pick the AI and move on.
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Serious question - what are examples of “well built customs “ that are “just as good” as an AI
I assume....none?How many SH'ers are doing parachute jumps with rifles they purchased?
I'm assuming very, very few.
Impact, Lone Peak, CDG, Zeus. I’d say they’re all as good or better than an AI action.Serious question - what are examples of “well built customs “ that are “just as good” as an AI
Meh I hear at those matches with wind and talc powder dust the AIs run the customs lock upWhat can an AI do at a PRS match that a Mausingfield can't, for example? Or a Lone Peak? Or a Impact? Etc
Not mine…The used AT used to just sit in the px. Got the one above for just over $3k. Since discontinuation they seem to keep climbing in the px. As we figured they would.
Used AT are selling for more money than used ATX it seems
Isn't Impact's (and Lone Peak too I guess) whole thing that they will run in exactly that moondust environment?Meh I hear at those matches with wind and talc powder dust the AIs run the customs lock up
The LFP may be why the lack of interest. People don’t realize you can have LRI bush the bolt as well but it adds a little bit of expense of course. Maybe add that to the adNot mine…
Not mine…
Would take it right away....im from germany thoughNot mine…
Isn't Impact's (and Lone Peak too I guess) whole thing that they will run in exactly that moondust environment?
A few years ago on here there was a thread and guys were talking about how tough their various custom rifles were and reliable. Tom Irwin from AINA offered to test anyone's rifle against an Ax or At in 2 story drops and enviromental tests, pretty sure that thread just went quiet, lmao.I'll be happy to offer my AW for any dirt/sand/ice/snow/parachute jump comparison vs any of those modern custom actions.
I owned customs and know pretty well which one is going down first. Anyone assuming a Remington 700 type action equals an AI is the only one butthurt in here. A Defiance might be way higher quality than a standard Remmy, however, it is still a Remmy.
Friends deviance went down with a broken extractor after 2000 rounds.
If my life depended on it, i'll pick the AI and move on.
View attachment 8463893
I’d have bought yours weeks ago if I was in a position to do so, but right now I’m just not.
I think the disconnect is that the people on SH (generally speaking, not all) are not using their rifles in conditions that would cause issues for either platform. And opining about hypothetical situations where your gun falls off a two story building is very weird for people who are not in very specific parts of the military.Let’s not pretend these custom rifles are on par with military grade rifles like the AI in terms of toughness or reliability in adverse conditions
We now have adjustable height magazine catches like in the ACC Elite or MDT M5 bottom metal for tuning the feeding reliability of two lug actions. I feel like the "custom actions don't run AW magazines as well" angle is losing a lot of traction. Even more so with 3 lug actions using 6 o'clock lugs like the ARC CDG for instance.The double stack mags are best in the business. Other actions run AICS or struggle with AW mags for the most part. Yes there are exceptions but the AW feed smoother and your not messing with mag lips on the AICS.
This is probably one of the strongest arguments. The triggers for R700 rifles do not have the reliability of other platforms, especially in extreme conditions. Though you may not have to go AI for that reliability, as a lot of Tikka or Sako guys would claim.I’ve seen countless triggers go down even in fclass matches. Jewel/trigger tech etc. the original AI is a much more reliable platform
A nearly nonexistent problem for modern custom actions, as they almost all have integral scope bases and recoil lugs. Again this seems like a dunk from 2015.I’ve seen scope base screws shear completely off of R700 action. With the AI your lucky to break it if you try
I’ve been looking for that thread. Got a link?A few years ago on here there was a thread and guys were talking about how tough their various custom rifles were and reliable. Tom Irwin from AINA offered to test anyone's rifle against an Ax or At in 2 story drops and enviromental tests, pretty sure that thread just went quiet, lmao.
Not weird. Just extreme to prove a more mundane point. It’s like torture tests that involve driving over a rifle with a truck. That doesn’t happen too often either but it still illustrates sturdiness.And opining about hypothetical situations where your gun falls off a two story building is very weird for people who are not in very specific parts of the military.
A few years ago on here there was a thread and guys were talking about how tough their various custom rifles were and reliable. Tom Irwin from AINA offered to test anyone's rifle against an Ax or At in 2 story drops and enviromental tests, pretty sure that thread just went quiet, lmao.
My response was more directed at people who claim the custom is just as reliable as the AI platform. Yes is most shooting conditions and the majority of shooters it is.I'm not even that invested in this argument but a lot of the mudslinging about custom actions feels like it's coming from 2015.
I think the disconnect is that the people on SH (generally speaking, not all) are not using their rifles in conditions that would cause issues for either platform. And opining about hypothetical situations where your gun falls off a two story building is very weird for people who are not in very specific parts of the military.
We now have adjustable height magazine catches like in the ACC Elite or MDT M5 bottom metal for tuning the feeding reliability of two lug actions. I feel like the "custom actions don't run AW magazines as well" angle is losing a lot of traction. Even more so with 3 lug actions using 6 o'clock lugs like the ARC CDG for instance.
This is probably one of the strongest arguments. The triggers for R700 rifles do not have the reliability of other platforms, especially in extreme conditions. Though you may not have to go AI for that reliability, as a lot of Tikka or Sako guys would claim.
A nearly nonexistent problem for modern custom actions, as they almost all have integral scope bases and recoil lugs. Again this seems like a dunk from 2015.
That's a whole other parallel can of worms. The Rokslide guys who do drop-testing and durability testing for zero retention with scopes get ridiculed here on SH. I would hope guys using AI's are using similarly rugged scopes and scope mounts too.The same arguments come up when you set an Athlon Cronus next to a NF ATACR. For most they’ll never notice anything but the extra weight of the NF and probably prefer the features of the Athlon. But they’re not the same in terms of toughness
I've shot courses and saw courses that use a tower or 2nd story platform. Would you bet several thousand that your rifle maybe, possibly could handle a fall vs knowing it won't hurt the rifle?I'm not even that invested in this argument but a lot of the mudslinging about custom actions feels like it's coming from 2015.
I think the disconnect is that the people on SH (generally speaking, not all) are not using their rifles in conditions that would cause issues for either platform. And opining about hypothetical situations where your gun falls off a two story building is very weird for people who are not in very specific parts of the military.
We now have adjustable height magazine catches like in the ACC Elite or MDT M5 bottom metal for tuning the feeding reliability of two lug actions. I feel like the "custom actions don't run AW magazines as well" angle is losing a lot of traction. Even more so with 3 lug actions using 6 o'clock lugs like the ARC CDG for instance.
I'll defer to your experience on this, since I'm just a casual shooter/hunter and haven't even shot a PRS match. How many guys from those tower or 2nd story platforms knocked their rifles off? Is that a thing I need to be worried about? Did their scopes survive that?I've shot courses and saw courses that use a tower or 2nd story platform. Would you bet several thousand that your rifle could handle a fall vs knowing it won't hurt the rifle?
Still relies on a 700 trigger...but a good one like a giessele 700 help.The Badger action is a knock off of the AI. I wouldn’t say it’s as good, but still a quality action.
I don’t know of anything else really comparable
I really hope they start making those triggers again.Still relies on a 700 trigger...but a good one like a giessele 700 help.
I've never saw it happen, could it, maybe, depends on how many tactical pillows are around. I'd say a scope rezeeo or swap would be needed. My point, and maybe it's not needed, is the guys that say my custom is just as tough as an AI, then say something like that isn't needed. 1 rifle will handle it and ready to back it up, the others "probably" could, but don't want to try. I don't want to throw my AIs, badgers, nuke, or solus off a building, so I suppose I'm guilty of not wanting to try, lol.I'll defer to your experience on this, since I'm just a casual shooter and haven't even shot a PRS match. How many guys from those tower or 2nd story platforms knocked their rifles off? Is that a thing I need to be worried about? Did their scopes survive that?
That 2nd paragraph is important, but in reality is there any scope and mount that could take a fall, scope first under 15lb rifle from 20'. I doubt it, but stock/chassis or bolt handle damage is also a concern for some rifles. I'll gladly admit the 2 story drop test is probably not a thing for 99% of shooters(#metoo). My point in mentioning it was AINAs confidence in their rifle.That's a whole other parallel can of worms. The Rokslide guys who do drop-testing and durability testing for zero retention with scopes get ridiculed here on SH. I would hope guys using AI's are using similarly rugged scopes and scope mounts too.
I guess for me (not that what I think matters at all) I'm on board with guys choosing AI for ultra-durability as long as they actually take durability seriously. Otherwise it's just LARPing to talk about that stuff. A rifle that can be dropped off a two-story building is great but won't help much if the scope won't retain zero from a 3 foot drop (and many of them won't).
Nothing is invincible, everything fails with enough duty cycle. My atx has never failed me. My 700 clones have never failed me. I've put 10x more rounds through my 700 clones. Ai bolt handles break, the comp trigger fails. TT diamonds fail, BnA get full of shit and can fail. 700 clone can fail. My atx won't feed 6gt for shit from aw mags, but uses. My 700 clone ARC aics mags perfect. However my CDG runs 6gt from bone stock aw mags like it was born for it. AI has no advantage over the top end 700 clones. You're buying a name that has pedigree and notoriety, that's it. AI no longer has supremacy over anything, cept premium prices, they still up on top that list. I like my atx, but it does nothing my other rigs do, cept quick swap a barrel, but I don't do that much anymore.I've never saw it happen, could it, maybe, depends on how many tactical pillows are around. I'd say a scope rezeeo or swap would be needed. My point, and maybe it's not needed, is the guys that say my custom is just as tough as an AI, then say something like that isn't needed. 1 rifle will handle it and ready to back it up, the others "probably" could, but don't want to try. I don't want to throw my AIs, badgers, nuke, or solus off a building, so I suppose I'm guilty of not wanting to try, lol.
I don't remember the thread, it's been several yrs ago maybe 5.
It was just a passing thought about how there's not much concentration on SH on the actual weak point of the rifle/aiming system (the scope and scope mount retaining zero from drops/impacts). I'm just trying to articulate why a lot of this rifle durability stuff feels contrived. We've got pages here of people discussing outlandish scenarios their rifles could survive but I almost never see people talking whether their scopes would still be zeroed if their rifle was leaning up against something and fell. Or, as the Rokslide guys test, whether their rifle/scope setup would still be zeroed after a ride in the back of a truck through the mountains. I haven't had lunch yet and I'm rambling, just an observation I find odd.That 2nd paragraph is important, but in reality is there any scope and mount that could take a fall, scope first under 15lb rifle from 20'. I doubt it, but stock/chassis or bolt handle damage is also a concern for some rifles. I'll gladly admit the 2 story drop test is probably not a thing for 99% of shooters(#metoo). My point in mentioning it was AINAs confidence in their rifle.