The war in Ukraine and Donbas

[NoDopes]

..

Now back to the question, what does Russia having to employ Wagner to do all the heavy lifting say about the Russians and their military?

This thread is about to get nuked. But before it does, isn't NATO employing Ukraine to do all the heavy dying?

 

[Darayavaus]

Don't you think anyone who earns an honest living and then has money stolen from them in the form of taxes, has a say in what that money is used for?
And if those taxes are sent overseas to perpetuate a war that his country organised after a coup it also organised, and that money is indirectly paying towards the deaths of civilians, then surely he has a right to an opinion and a say in where that money goes?

he's Ukrainian, so he's rubbing one out at the thought of how pissed off Americans are right now, with all of our tax money being stolen without our consent, to be given to all his dill eating [svoloch] relatives and their tiny, soros-installed [svoloch] overlord

 

[Forgetful Coyote]

That must be some strong drugs you are on if after all this time that is your take away. You’ve killed way way too many brain cells.

Gender transition?
Yeah, none of the aid went to defending a democracy from tyranny.

Way to gas light your lack of intelligence.

Better to have half my brain cells dead(still smarter than you regardless BTW) than to have blind allegiance to a system that works completely against my own self interest...

Until we fix our problems at home, not one single penny, much less a single American life(not even yours) should be spent in Ukraine or elsewhere. Rome is burning, yet smoothbrains like you still cheer on the world police games.

Imagine that, if half or even one quarter of the effort and treasure being wasted in Ukraine, were turned inward instead to strengthen our society.

 

[232593]

Blood, sweat, treasure. I lived in Ukraine for 4 years and recently came back and still have relatives in country.

You didn’t contribute anything. Give me a refund on your birth.

So you contributed to Ukraine. Yay.

What have you done for the U. S?

I’ll give you a refund for mine just as soon as you give me one for yours there sparky.

 

[232593]

Better to have half my brain cells dead(still smarter than you regardless BTW) than to have blind allegiance to a system that works completely against my own self interest...

Until we fix our problems at home, not one single penny, much less a single American life(not even yours) should be spent in Ukraine or elsewhere. Rome is burning, yet smoothbrains like you still cheer on the world police games.

Imagine that, if half or even one quarter of the effort and treasure being wasted in Ukraine, were turned inward instead to strengthen our society.

Or controlling our southern border

 

[Ranger3/75]

Don't you think anyone who earns an honest living and then has money stolen from them in the form of taxes, has a say in what that money is used for?
And if those taxes are sent overseas to perpetuate a war that his country organised after a coup it also organised, and that money is indirectly paying towards the deaths of civilians, then surely he has a right to an opinion and a say in where that money goes?

This is the shit I’ve pointed out repeatedly. Stupidity. Straight ignorance to facts. The constant regurgitating of nonsense as fact.

Nothing you said is rooted in the truth.

Ukraine’s “coup” how you ignorantly put it was against Putin’s puppet Yanukovych.

Those that died for freedom are known throughout the country as the heavenly 100.

A “coup” from a foreign entity does not look like this. Ukrainians are bleeding for this. They have been since 2014.

Ukraine is a democracy. It has had 2 different presidents since freedom from Putin. 2 from very different political parties. Both fighting against an invader.


What’s going on in Ukraine is very simple. Putin lost control and wants Ukraine within the realm of Russian influence at all costs. Tyranny.

America stands as a beacon of freedom to the world. As an American why would you support tyrants, scoundrels, thieves?

We support our allies, we support democracy, not self appointed dictators.

If you don’t support democracy. If you don’t support freedom, really what the fuck are you doing here?

 

[232593]

This is the shit I’ve pointed out repeatedly. Stupidity. Straight ignorance to facts. The constant regurgitating of nonsense as fact.

Nothing you said is rooted in the truth.

Ukraine’s “coup” how you ignorantly put it was against Putin’s puppet Yanukovych.

Those that died for freedom are known throughout the country as the heavenly 100.

A “coup” from a foreign entity does not look like this. Ukrainians are bleeding for this. They have been since 2014.

Ukraine is a democracy. It has had 2 different presidents since freedom from Putin. 2 from very different political parties. Both fighting against an invader.


What’s going on in Ukraine is very simple. Putin lost control and wants Ukraine within the realm of Russian influence at all costs. Tyranny.

America stands as a beacon of freedom to the world. As an American why would you support tyrants, scoundrels, thieves?

We support our allies, we support democracy, not self appointed dictators.

If you don’t support democracy. If you don’t support freedom, really what the fuck are you doing here?

Hey dipshit, find the word “democracy” in the constitution. I’ll wait.

 

[GreenGO Juan]

Better to have half my brain cells dead(still smarter than you regardless BTW) than to have blind allegiance to a system that works completely against my own self interest...

Until we fix our problems at home, not one single penny, much less a single American life(not even yours) should be spent in Ukraine or elsewhere. Rome is burning, yet smoothbrains like you still cheer on the world police games.

Imagine that, if half or even one quarter of the effort and treasure being wasted in Ukraine, were turned inward instead to strengthen our society.

Stop with all that logic.

 

[wade2big]

This is the shit I’ve pointed out repeatedly. Stupidity. Straight ignorance to facts. The constant regurgitating of nonsense as fact.

Nothing you said is rooted in the truth.

Ukraine’s “coup” how you ignorantly put it was against Putin’s puppet Yanukovych.

Those that died for freedom are known throughout the country as the heavenly 100.

A “coup” from a foreign entity does not look like this. Ukrainians are bleeding for this. They have been since 2014.

Ukraine is a democracy. It has had 2 different presidents since freedom from Putin. 2 from very different political parties. Both fighting against an invader.


What’s going on in Ukraine is very simple. Putin lost control and wants Ukraine within the realm of Russian influence at all costs. Tyranny.

America stands as a beacon of freedom to the world. As an American why would you support tyrants, scoundrels, thieves?

We support our allies, we support democracy, not self appointed dictators.

If you don’t support democracy. If you don’t support freedom, really what the fuck are you doing here?

Every gov’t in the world is run by tyrants, scoundrels, and thieves and empowered by anything for a paycheck statists fucks who work for gov’t for a paycheck. The most corrupt of them all is right here in the good ole USA.

No man that believes in gov’t can claim they support freedom and liberty as gov’t at its very root is men ruling over others using armed robbery and violence to force the will of a few onto the many.

 

[GreenGO Juan]

Trotsky, Prizoghin. History repeats in Russia, a hotel room with an ice axe is probably waiting for him in Minsk

Pretty interesting to hear his take on it. Hear the similar stories coming from Ukrainian soldiers. Money's being stolen.

All the more reason we should be looking after our own, not sending billions into this mess.

 

[JR_77]

This is the shit I’ve pointed out repeatedly. Stupidity. Straight ignorance to facts. The constant regurgitating of nonsense as fact.

Nothing you said is rooted in the truth.

Ukraine’s “coup” how you ignorantly put it was against Putin’s puppet Yanukovych.

Those that died for freedom are known throughout the country as the heavenly 100.

A “coup” from a foreign entity does not look like this. Ukrainians are bleeding for this. They have been since 2014.

Ukraine is a democracy. It has had 2 different presidents since freedom from Putin. 2 from very different political parties. Both fighting against an invader.


What’s going on in Ukraine is very simple. Putin lost control and wants Ukraine within the realm of Russian influence at all costs. Tyranny.

America stands as a beacon of freedom to the world. As an American why would you support tyrants, scoundrels, thieves?

We support our allies, we support democracy, not self appointed dictators.

If you don’t support democracy. If you don’t support freedom, really what the fuck are you doing here?

Repost originally from Bender.

 

[232593]

Pretty interesting to hear his take on it. Hear the similar stories coming from Ukrainian soldiers. Money's being stolen.

All the more reason we should be looking after our own, not sending billions into this mess.

Yeah but then who’d pay for Borat to glow in this thread?

 

[PhilOX11]

This is the shit I’ve pointed out repeatedly. Stupidity. Straight ignorance to facts. The constant regurgitating of nonsense as fact.

Nothing you said is rooted in the truth.

Ukraine’s “coup” how you ignorantly put it was against Putin’s puppet Yanukovych.

Those that died for freedom are known throughout the country as the heavenly 100.

A “coup” from a foreign entity does not look like this. Ukrainians are bleeding for this. They have been since 2014.

Ukraine is a democracy. It has had 2 different presidents since freedom from Putin. 2 from very different political parties. Both fighting against an invader.


What’s going on in Ukraine is very simple. Putin lost control and wants Ukraine within the realm of Russian influence at all costs. Tyranny.

America stands as a beacon of freedom to the world. As an American why would you support tyrants, scoundrels, thieves?

We support our allies, we support democracy, not self appointed dictators.

If you don’t support democracy. If you don’t support freedom, really what the fuck are you doing here?

I am not there, I am an Englishman, living in England. Presumption can get you in a lot of trouble!
You say you got rid of Putin's puppet, but then you installed globalist puppets and act as money launders for the clinton and biden families.
I have not been back to Ukraine since the coup took place, but I know how happy normal working people were before it. Ukraine and Russia have always been close, until the crooks took over in 2014.
How do I know?
I lived and worked in Russia, I have friends and family in Russia and Ukraine and I am so sad that globalist governments forced this war on Ukraine to get at Russia.
As for America being a beacon of freedom, what a load of bollocks! My country is as f**ked as yours is due to the corruption at the top and democracy went out of the window in America at the same time it did in England.
You ask why would I support tyrants, scoundrels and thieves, yet many Americans voted for biden!
If I had time or could be arsed, I would list all the countries England and America have bribed, blackmailed and strongarmed into being influenced by them.
I do like a good debate, but please wake up, do some research and read a few history books before you reply, theres a good chap.

 

[Darayavaus]

I love when he uses catchphrases that only some Pravy Sektor Azov assholes would care about.

'the Heavenly Hundred" of nazis who died in the uprising.

nobody here, possibly aside from Gaywolf or Steve Pedoski, gives a rat's ass about the "heavenly hundred". They could be the Hundred Hohols, Hundred Homos, or whatever. nobody even cares.

 

[232593]

Decent roll up

ZeroHedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

So was it an attempted poorly planned and executed coup? Maskirovka? I wonder if we’ll ever really know.

What I have not heard is how things went at the operational & tactical echelon. Did the Ukrainian’s seize the initiative and renew their counteroffensive? Or did they do nothing? If they took no action that unto itself could be telling.

 

[Forgetful Coyote]

I am not there, I am an Englishman, living in England. Presumption can get you in a lot of trouble!
You say you got rid of Putin's puppet, but then you installed globalist puppets and act as money launders for the clinton and biden families.
I have not been back to Ukraine since the coup took place, but I know how happy normal working people were before it. Ukraine and Russia have always been close, until the crooks took over in 2014.
How do I know?
I lived and worked in Russia, I have friends and family in Russia and Ukraine and I am so sad that globalist governments forced this war on Ukraine to get at Russia.
As for America being a beacon of freedom, what a load of bollocks! My country is as f**ked as yours is due to the corruption at the top and democracy went out of the window in America at the same time it did in England.
You ask why would I support tyrants, scoundrels and thieves, yet many Americans voted for biden!
If I had time or could be arsed, I would list all the countries England and America have bribed, blackmailed and strongarmed into being influenced by them.
I do like a good debate, but please wake up, do some research and read a few history books before you reply, theres a good chap.

Damn.. first time I ever really seen a based Brit..

 

[PhilOX11]

Decent roll up

ZeroHedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

So was it an attempted poorly planned and executed coup? Maskirovka? I wonder if we’ll ever really know.

What I have not heard is how things went at the operational & tactical echelon. Did the Ukrainian’s seize the initiative and renew their counteroffensive? Or did they do nothing? If they took no action that unto itself could be telling.

Now the circus is out of town I would expect reports from the front to pick up again.

 

[PhilOX11]

Damn.. first time I ever really seen a based Brit..

Is that a compliment?
Two people separated by a common language etc.....

 

[wade2big]

Is that a compliment?
Two people separated by a common language etc.....

It’s a compliment although a bit underhanded.

I’m liking what you have been throwing down as well my friend.

 

[Darayavaus]

Is that a compliment?
Two people separated by a common language etc.....

based means red pilled.

Wiltshire? I went through it a few times and visited Salisbury Cathedral, but most of my time there I spent in the West Country. I haven't had good Cornish pasties or room temperature cider on tap since I left.

 

[PhilOX11]

It’s a compliment although a bit underhanded.

I’m liking what you have been throwing down as well my friend.

If ever you get to England look me up and we can trade friendly insults over a few beers!

 

[PhilOX11]

based means red pilled.

Wiltshire? I went through it a few times and visited Salisbury Cathedral, but most of my time there I spent in the West Country. I haven't had good Cornish pasties or room temperature cider on tap since I left.

Wiltshire is a lovely county with lots of hunting land. I moved here 10 years ago and love it.
Cornish pasties and cider, what a way to spend an afternoon in the sun.

 

[Darayavaus]

Wiltshire is a lovely county with lots of hunting land. I moved here 10 years ago and love it.
Cornish pasties and cider, what a way to spend an afternoon in the sun.

many of the kids I taught were history buffs, hunters and very conservative. That area is "old England" and proud of itself, for it's own sake. Just like rural "old America" is proud, patriotic, and thoroughly disgusted with the international socialists and their global order.

 

[PhilOX11]

many of the kids I taught were history buffs, hunters and very conservative. That area is "old England" and proud of itself, for it's own sake. Just like rural "old America" is proud, patriotic, and thoroughly disgusted with the international socialists and their global order.

Spot on!

 

[pmclaine]

This is the shit I’ve pointed out repeatedly. Stupidity. Straight ignorance to facts. The constant regurgitating of nonsense as fact.

Nothing you said is rooted in the truth.

Ukraine’s “coup” how you ignorantly put it was against Putin’s puppet Yanukovych.

Those that died for freedom are known throughout the country as the heavenly 100.

A “coup” from a foreign entity does not look like this. Ukrainians are bleeding for this. They have been since 2014.

Ukraine is a democracy. It has had 2 different presidents since freedom from Putin. 2 from very different political parties. Both fighting against an invader.


What’s going on in Ukraine is very simple. Putin lost control and wants Ukraine within the realm of Russian influence at all costs. Tyranny.

America stands as a beacon of freedom to the world. As an American why would you support tyrants, scoundrels, thieves?

We support our allies, we support democracy, not self appointed dictators.

If you don’t support democracy. If you don’t support freedom, really what the fuck are you doing here?

You were right caricature was the wrong word.

I should have used cuckold.

 

[pmclaine]

Decent roll up

ZeroHedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

So was it an attempted poorly planned and executed coup? Maskirovka? I wonder if we’ll ever really know.

What I have not heard is how things went at the operational & tactical echelon. Did the Ukrainian’s seize the initiative and renew their counteroffensive? Or did they do nothing? If they took no action that unto itself could be telling.

Streltsy fucked around and found out……

Wagner should hope Putin doesnt read up on how Peter the Great dealt with it.

 

[Ranger3/75]

So you contributed to Ukraine. Yay.

What have you done for the U. S?

I’ll give you a refund for mine just as soon as you give me one for yours there sparky.

I fought two wars for the United States.

What have you done turd?

 

[Ranger3/75]

Hey dipshit, find the word “democracy” in the constitution. I’ll wait.

The United States is a Democratic Republic. Read the federalist papers some time moron, it’s outlined several times. Written by the founding fathers.

 

[pmclaine]

The United States is a Democratic Republic. Read the federalist papers some time moron, it’s outlined several times. Written by the founding fathers.

The fact you didn’t capitalize Founding Fathers says a lot about you.

 

[pmclaine]

I fought two wars for the United States.

What have you done turd?

https://www.heritage-history.com/site/hclass/secret_societies/ebooks/pdf/butler_racket.pdf

Guessing you will call the author a pussy.

 

[Ranger3/75]

The fact you didn’t capitalize Founding Fathers says a lot about you.

The fact that everything is sexual in nature to you speaks volumes about you. Probably 400lb, ugly, and living in mamas basement.

Basement dweller.

 

[wade2big]

I fought two wars for the United States.

What have you done turd?

You fought two wars on behalf and to the benefit of politicians and those who bought them you fool. You only added to the problem when you willingly gave up your personal sovereignty to fight foreign banker wars. A man that would do such a thing has no grounds to preach about the freedom of others when he didn’t give a fuck about or value his own. I don’t believe you anyhow.

 

[pmclaine]

The fact that everything is sexual in nature to you speaks volumes about you. Probably 400lb, ugly, and living in mamas basement.

Basement dweller.

Nailed it!

Just like me with your Mom.

 

[Ranger3/75]

I am not there, I am an Englishman, living in England. Presumption can get you in a lot of trouble!
You say you got rid of Putin's puppet, but then you installed globalist puppets and act as money launders for the clinton and biden families.
I have not been back to Ukraine since the coup took place, but I know how happy normal working people were before it. Ukraine and Russia have always been close, until the crooks took over in 2014.
How do I know?
I lived and worked in Russia, I have friends and family in Russia and Ukraine and I am so sad that globalist governments forced this war on Ukraine to get at Russia.
As for America being a beacon of freedom, what a load of bollocks! My country is as f**ked as yours is due to the corruption at the top and democracy went out of the window in America at the same time it did in England.
You ask why would I support tyrants, scoundrels and thieves, yet many Americans voted for biden!
If I had time or could be arsed, I would list all the countries England and America have bribed, blackmailed and strongarmed into being influenced by them.
I do like a good debate, but please wake up, do some research and read a few history books before you reply, theres a good chap.

Yeah, bullshit. Go speak that crap anywhere in Ukraine and see what happens to you.

You are living a fantasy.

 

[Ranger3/75]

You fought two wars on behalf and to the benefit of politicians and those who bought them you fool. You only added to the problem when you willingly gave up your personal sovereignty to fight foreign banker wars. A man that would do such a thing has no grounds to preach about the freedom of others when he didn’t give a fuck about or value his own. I don’t believe you anyhow.

Spoken like a true moron and coward.

We were attacked on September 11th 2001. We should of rolled over and did nothing? This is a gun forum right? full of weaklings, cowards, freedom hating sniveling shits. Fuck how low this place has fallen.

 

[wade2big]

Spoken like a true moron and coward.

We were attacked on September 11th 2001. We should of rolled over and did nothing? This is a gun forum right? full of weaklings, cowards, freedom hating sniveling shits. Fuck how low this place has fallen.

It gets lower every post you make, you big government fuck. A military conformist screaming freedom, individualism, etc is laughable.

 

[Ranger3/75]

It gets lower every post you make, you big government fuck. A military conformist screaming freedom, individualism, etc is laughable.

You do understand the majority here are cock gobbling on dictatorships. Under a dictatorship you have no freedom. No guns. No freedom of speech. Nothing.

Where did I ever say I was for big government dumbass?

 

[wade2big]

You do understand the majority here are cock gobbling on dictatorships. Under a dictatorship you have no freedom. No guns. No freedom of speech. Nothing.

Where did I ever say I was for big government dumbass?

When you added to the 24,000,000 man strong gov’t. A man cannot be a proponent of a small limited government when he works for and empowers the exact opposite. My goodness the reasoning and logic capabilities many of you people have is next to nothing. I bet you made a great soldier all things considered.

 

[pmclaine]

Spoken like a true moron and coward.

We were attacked on September 11th 2001. We should of rolled over and did nothing? This is a gun forum right? full of weaklings, cowards, freedom hating sniveling shits. Fuck how low this place has fallen.

Doing nothing would have been the best answer.

Sept 10, 2001 was the last really good day in this country. Other generations say we lost it earlier.

All we got out of our response was a camera at every exit ramp, the Patriot Act, a legally weaponized intelligence apparatus and 13 Marines KIA and an untold number of horribly maimed in the most embarrassing withdrawal ever…..

Neither country invaded has freedom and we have lost ours.

 

[Darayavaus]

My goodness the reasoning and logic capabilities many of you people have is next to nothing. I bet you made a great soldier all things considered.

there was a great line in an old movie called "the man who would be king"

"Good soldiers don't think, they just obey! Do you suppose that if a man thought twice, he'd give his life for Queen and Country? Not bloody likely! He wouldn't go near the battlefield! One look at your foolish faces tells me that you're going to be crack troops. Ohhh him there with the five-and-a-half hat size has the makings of a bloody hero!"

 

[Rthur]

More pure lies and garbage.

You’ve already made it clear that you are of middle eastern descent and have nothing but praise for the Ayatollah and other ruthless tyrants like him and Putin.
What the fuck are you doing in the United States if you hate our values so much.

Drop the crack pipe ya fucking idiot.
How can anyone call another a liar when they gobble up the MSM byline?
BTW there are many things to hate about the USA, lately and not so new.

R

 

[Emerson0311]

Pedofile?

View attachment 8169473

My education is limited. I defer to those with polished CVs.

 

[Bender]

Time to grab a beer and watch all the Putin fanboys scramble to explain yet another failure as being anyone’s fault but his.

After enough embarrassing losses it might be time to question whether strongman leaders are just not good at leading instead of inventing ever larger copespiracies.

Where is the chest thumping now?

 

[Ranger3/75]

Drop the crack pipe ya fucking idiot.
How can anyone call another a liar when they gobble up the MSM byline?
BTW there are many things to hate about the USA, lately and not so new.

R

Do you hear yourself. The MSM byline.

Who do you get news from? Some crack pot on YouTube?

If you want to know the truth you see it for yourself. Travel to Ukraine. You have the freedom to do so.


This shit y’all are posting here is some of the dumbest shit I’ve ever seen. Thanks for the laughs.

 

[PhilOX11]

Yeah, bullshit. Go speak that crap anywhere in Ukraine and see what happens to you.

You are living a fantasy.

Oh dear, it is such a shame when someone who drools for a living gets access to the internet!
I did ask you to do some research and read a few history books, maybe ask your career to read and explain the messages next time.
Now be a good boy, take your medication and have a nap.

 

[SilentStalkr]

Do you hear yourself. The MSM byline.

Who do you get news from? Some crack pot on YouTube?

If you want to know the truth you see it for yourself. Travel to Ukraine. You have the freedom to do so.


This shit y’all are posting here is some of the dumbest shit I’ve ever seen. Thanks for the laughs.

Curious. I have not read through this entire thread. What is it you’d like us to garner from going to the Ukraine exactly?

 

[PhilOX11]

Spoken like a true moron and coward.

We were attacked on September 11th 2001. We should of rolled over and did nothing? This is a gun forum right? full of weaklings, cowards, freedom hating sniveling shits. Fuck how low this place has fallen.

Spoken like a comic reading 12 year old.
The last thing I ever wanted in a war zone was to be next to someone who really wanted to be there.

 

[Ranger3/75]

Doing nothing would have been the best answer.

Sept 10, 2001 was the last really good day in this country. Other generations say we lost it earlier.

All we got out of our response was a camera at every exit ramp, the Patriot Act, a legally weaponized intelligence apparatus and 13 Marines KIA and an untold number of horribly maimed in the most embarrassing withdrawal ever…..

Neither country invaded has freedom and we have lost ours.

Exactly my point. You are a weakling and a coward. You made that crystal clear, pussy.

No freedom? You own guns do you not? You have freedoms to express your warped mentality do you not?

Muslim extremists declared war on the United States. Afghanistan and Iraq were fields where jihadi’s went to fight us. There were foreign fighters from all the stan’s in both countries.

I do not agree with the Patriot act and fisa courts. They undermine the system.
Yet, the Patriot act has stopped jihadi’s and made it easier to find them, tsarnaev brothers are a good example.

 

[PhilOX11]

Exactly my point. You are a weakling and a coward. You made that crystal clear, pussy.

No freedom? You own guns do you not? You have freedoms to express your warped mentality do you not?

Muslim extremists declared war on the United States. Afghanistan and Iraq were fields where jihadi’s went to fight us. There were foreign fighters from all the stan’s in both countries.

I do not agree with the Patriot act and fisa courts. They undermine the system.
Yet, the Patriot act has stopped jihadi’s and made it easier to find them, tsarnaev brothers are a good example.

I genuinely thought people who spoke like this and believed lying politicians were a figment of a script writers imagination when coming up with characters for a low budget movie.
How very, very worrying that they exist!

 

[Ranger3/75]

Curious. I have not read through this entire thread. What is it you’d like us to garner from going to the Ukraine exactly?

To see the people, talk with the people, see the reality of the situation with your own eyes. Uninfluenced by others.

So much misinformation is out there. All these idiots on here sucking Putin’s cock would have you believe that it is a CIA controlled government and everyone and their mother is a Nazi or a flaming homosexual.

In reality it’s more like what I think the US was in the early 1960’s. They are just regular people that love freedom, their nation, and want to be left alone. It is much less a police state than the US has become.