6gt
- Thread starter Dthomas3523
- Start date
Cool seeing this ad in a magazine I just pulled out of my mailbox. 
No loading today.....but I did knock out some brass prep.
This 100rd batch is now ready to prime, charge and seat.
Gonna sleep on it tonight and load 'em in the morning.
Good coffee will be waiting.
This 100rd batch is now ready to prime, charge and seat.
Gonna sleep on it tonight and load 'em in the morning.
Good coffee will be waiting.
No loading today.....but I did knock out some brass prep.
This 100rd batch is now ready to prime, charge and seat.
Gonna sleep on it tonight and load 'em in the morning.
Good coffee will be waiting.
View attachment 8451265View attachment 8451266View attachment 8451267
Great sales prices on the 6mm Match Burners this week at MidwayUSA.
Picked up 1,000.
Thanks.
Going to get busy on the loading as soon as finish up on the rifle assembly.
This afternoon, hopefully.
No loading today.....but I did knock out some brass prep.
This 100rd batch is now ready to prime, charge and seat.
Gonna sleep on it tonight and load 'em in the morning.
Good coffee will be waiting.
View attachment 8451265View attachment 8451266View attachment 8451267
I guess I am the only ignorant one here - what am I looking at in the primer area in the first picture? Sorry, but I cannot figure it out. They are not loaded primers, but do not appear to be shot primers with a dent. What is that?
Shiny clean or new primer pockets... Reflections of the flash holes in the sides of the pockets?
Man I wish I had tried those. I really want to get away from the 109 hybrid bc I can't always find them and 2 for the price. I have read so much about the MB being inconsistent. I have to get some to give a try. If I knew my barrel would like them I would get 3k for the season.
Just get the 108 or 109 eldm. They run great for any match related shoots.
I know some people like them, but in the 3 6mm barrels I have had, I have never had one shoot the eldm. I have had them like a tips. But nothing a consistent as the 109 from group to group and day to day. They just seem to have such a large tuning window.
108 elite hunter is a hybrid ogive. I also ran 108 BT and 107 SMK with good success. 107s can be had for less $$.
Yea I talk to Berger about that also but never tested them, but they did confirm its a hybrid with a thinner jacket. The 107 and 110smk are on the list to test with the new barrel. I have 2 more comps to finish the season with my 6cm then I'll be making the swap. I really want to find a cheaper bullet for practice and then use the 109 for comps. Maybe I will get lucky and find a cheaper bullet I like.
I am running 115 DTACs in mine now. I was in same boat trying to find a good replacement. DTACs are doing very well.
33.2 of RL 15.5 @ 2830. I can run them faster, but they like low 2800s more.
The MBs are way more consistent than their price suggests.
The average reloader? Not so much lol
I’ve been going back and forth between MBs and A-Tips and if I miss, it’s me, not the bullet’s fault.
I am just now getting my sea legs back underneath me after a 20 absence from reloading.
Now I have the time and space to set things up.
Mighty enjoyable.
I have no plans for any competitive stuff.....just a mid-50's guy who is enjoying getting into longer range shooting.
4 more years until retirement.....hopefully get knee replacements done prior to that.....then perhaps the circumstances will line up for me to trying my hand at some formal shooting beyond just plinking with buddies and trash talking.
My first attempts at putting together a target gun have gone fairly smoothly.
Spun on the action and completed the assembly yesterday.
Hopefully time will permit for getting some rounds loaded later this afternoon.
This is the 105gr MB.....representative of what it measures at jam in my barrel.
Gonna back it up and load 5-10 rounds at incremental charge weights and see how she does.
The fire is stoked.
The MBs are way more consistent than their price suggests.
The average reloader? Not so much lol
I’ve been going back and forth between MBs and A-Tips and if I miss, it’s me, not the bullet’s fault.
Your posts on the MB gave me the confidence to try them.
I have some ELDM's & Varget set aside for this gun.......but I wanted to first get started with a more affordable combination. My local range sells SW Precision for $35-$40 / lb to range members. I've asked him to check on 8lb jug pricing. Until then I am trying to buy 1lb from same lot #'s.
105gr MB over SW Precision this evening or early tomorrow morning
Hoping to find an accurate load in the medium-->3/4-ish charge range.
Thank you for helping get this plan going through your comments.
I'd have never tried them....and been unaware. Barnes, in my mind, was strictly all-copper hunting stuff.
Mighty glad to learn other wise.
If there's anything I've learned about components, it's that to truly know you've got to try it yourself...usually, in bulk.
Because we cannot find out if the shit part is the new component, or us, over 100rds. Having some skin in the game makes it so giving up or quitting isn't too easy...
Some components are better than others for sure, but if one thinks a $0.60 projectile is twice as good as a $0.30 projectile every time, they're kidding themselves. Buy some, throw some on a fancy scale, measure some with some fancy calipers, and most of all, shoot them and see. They might be 1% better, maybe 5% better depending on what facet you're scrutinizing, but the difference isn't as vast as some guys think it is.
The longer I do this shit the more I feel like the main limiting factor is really the monkey pulling the handle/trigger. lol
Because we cannot find out if the shit part is the new component, or us, over 100rds. Having some skin in the game makes it so giving up or quitting isn't too easy...
Some components are better than others for sure, but if one thinks a $0.60 projectile is twice as good as a $0.30 projectile every time, they're kidding themselves. Buy some, throw some on a fancy scale, measure some with some fancy calipers, and most of all, shoot them and see. They might be 1% better, maybe 5% better depending on what facet you're scrutinizing, but the difference isn't as vast as some guys think it is.
The longer I do this shit the more I feel like the main limiting factor is really the monkey pulling the handle/trigger. lol
In my case there is no doubt about it....the monkey pulling the trigger is most assuredly the choke point to greatness.
I have nowhere to go but up......(or broke).
yes sir !!!!!In my case there is no doubt about it....the monkey pulling the trigger is most assuredly the choke point to greatness.
I have nowhere to go but up......(or broke).
I have ran em 2830-2880 depending on barrel length, all 7.5tw, DA between 3000-7000, my g7 of 314 has been money inside 1000y, to 1400 it needed 312g7 for waterline. I run 313avg, been solid! This is a low psi load of 35.6gr of H4350, I can take the Same load and run it in 26 28 and 30" barrels and it's sub half minute. Seated 20k jump in a 0.170fb chamber.
That's very promising. I shoot on a range with very unpredictable, switching winds so any advantage helps. My .308 (155gr @2650, 20")load is very accurate but gets blown around easily. I think the GT with a 115gr could be a nice upgrade.
My barrel was cut with an Alpha Munitions Legacy Reamer with a .120” freebore.
Anybody have any advice or suggestions applicable to me and my chamber? I do not know anything about it other than what I wrote in the line above this one, well, other than the rather obvious math of .170-.120 = .050"
Anybody have any advice or suggestions applicable to me and my chamber? I do not know anything about it other than what I wrote in the line above this one, well, other than the rather obvious math of .170-.120 = .050"
Only that you might have a hard time getting the longer/heavier bullets in there like 115 dtac. Otherwise you’re good to go. My latest barrel was apparently NOT cut with an Alpha reamer and now need to go through and small base size all my alpha brass
.120 freebore is perfect for 100 - 107gr stuff. Once you get into exclusively the 110 A-Tip through 115 DTAC, I'd probably look into the .170 just to get optimal performance. 108/109 works great in either from what I've seen, and I have run them with success in my .120.
In all reality, we're talking only .050 difference. There are a lot of cartridges with a much wider freebore gap (.223 comes to mind) when it comes to which is optimal for specific bullets.
In all reality, we're talking only .050 difference. There are a lot of cartridges with a much wider freebore gap (.223 comes to mind) when it comes to which is optimal for specific bullets.
The heavier weight of the projectile versus something like a 105 is what gives you the higher BC, it’s not really a question of MV.
IME DTACs hammer anywhere in the 2750-2850fps range without really having to worry about pressure issues.
A .120 versus .170 freebore will just limit how much you can jump, with heavier 109+ bullets you’ll be lucky if you can go as much as 20 thou off, chances are you’ll have to go more like 10 thou off… that said, it’s not a huge deal.
Have any of you tried Berger 115gr VLD Target or 115gr VLD Hunter bullets for PRS?
I'm pondering whether if there would be value in creating a dtac like load vs Berger 105gr or 109gr hybrids. I'm trying to avoid getting into .25 cal as well.
I'm pondering whether if there would be value in creating a dtac like load vs Berger 105gr or 109gr hybrids. I'm trying to avoid getting into .25 cal as well.
BC is a function of velocity. If you look at Hornady they quote different values for different velocities hence the question. 2,800 sounds sufficient though.
@Malum Prohibitum, 170fb is good for everything in my opinion. My ladies backup barrel is 170fb, and 105hyb shoot very well 60-80k jump at 2950fps. 109s shoot great jumping 40k at 2920. 115s at 2840fps jumping 20k. If. You only plan to shoot 105/107gr bullets, go 120, but if you're gonna go heavier, run the 170fb
IMHO you’re onto something here… a 112/115 going ~2800 is pretty awesome as far as being low recoil and relatively easy to spot. I’ve been shooting 106s lately after shooting a bunch of 112s and I have been missing the splash from the heavier pills a bit, there’s a difference for sure.
It seems like a huge PITA to go to 25 cal versus just shooting the heavier pills in 6mm, just for an extra ~20gn of mass and a little extra BC (in exchange for more recoil of course).
I don't have a choice at this point in time. Maybe on the next barrel.
For what it's worth, you actually can have your gunsmith lengthen the throat, if desired, using a throating reamer. Obviously, if you had a .170 FB, you couldn't get to a .120 without setting the barrel back, but going longer is relatively easy.
Or... shoot 1000 rounds, and you'll pretty much be there anyway? LOL
That’s the great thing about the DTACS , you don’t have to push them hard. Last years barrel I ran them at 2775fps with a trued BC of .310 . Shot them in matches out to 1300. This years barrel Im shooting them at 2815fps with a trued BC of .313. Don’t know if it’s just them or that I’m using Proof 1-7 blanks but they both shoot the smallest groups at 500 and 1000 than any other bullet barrel combo. My new barrel has a .185 freebore.
What's really enlightening is looking at how much of a wind change will push you off a target at a given distance. I don't really care what number I have to dial on the elevation turret (as long as its consistent) - and I've learned not to care what the exact number I have to dial/hold for wind is, either. What helps me the most is how wind tolerant the bullet is - how much can my wind call be off, or how much does the wind have to fluctuate before I'm off target. And then how much retained energy at each distance...
I did an analysis between a bunch of 6mm bullets before I ended up selecting Berger 108 BTs (they were available, which was important, but I could've waited or bought a smaller amount, etc). What's nuts is how little difference there is between most bullets for wind tolerance. Consider a 2 MOA target. At 1000 yards using the same muzzle velocity, every bullet I looked at but one had a wind tolerance of about 2 mph - and one that was better (the A-Tip, of course) was only 2.5mph. It's not a lot of difference in terms of keeping bullets on target at distance. The A-Tip and the Berger 109 both have a bit more tolerance at 600y than the others. (5mph vs 4 mph).
Where I *have* noticed the difference is retained energy. I'll hit targes at 1000 and there's not a whole lot going on (467 ft lbs at 1000), where an A-Tip at the same starting velocity will have more than 20% more energy...
You’ll have more wind change with 108’s than you will 115 DTACS. I’m finishing out an old barrel right now using 108 BT’s and there’s definitely a difference between the two.
6mph and 10mph
108’s
115’s
DTACs weren't part of my analysis (at the time, they were seemingly less available than berger 109s) - but to do apples to apples - what's the spread between W1 and W2 on your Kestrel, there?
To be clear, I'm not saying DTACs are in some way inferior (or any other bullet, for that matter). By BC, the DTAC should be in the same situation as the A-Tip as far as my analysis goes. My point is that there's not a dramatic difference on target vs. the ability to make a 100% accurate wind call, and the ability to read changing conditions (but that retained energy - and therefore ease of spotting hits/misses at distance - is definitely significant).
Wind 6mph and 10mph
108’s .7 spread
115 DTACS .6 spread
Doesn’t sound like much but you’d have to push the 108’s at 3000fps to get them the same as the DTACs
And yes it all comes down to making good wind calls no matter your bullet or it’s speed
I ran my numbers at 90 degrees (vs 52) - which should pull you down to about a 2mph change crossing .5 mil with the 108.. and I'd guess about 3mph with the DTAC (same as A-Tip). Don't have my Kestrel in front of me to do it myself, but looks like that'd line up. But at 1000, you've got what, 550 ft/lbs retained energy? Maybe more? After shooting these 108s for a while, that's actually a bit more significant for me than the wind difference at 1000 yards.
That said - they're available, and significantly cheaper than any of the yellow box bullets, and far cheaper than the A-Tip - price per performance, hard to beat that way...
